ORUTerry Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I re-read all of the posts and I don't see anyone excusing ORU for this situation. We have all said that it is unfortunate and certainly embarrassing for the athletic department & school. The athletic department apparently realized their oversight/error and issued a press release. And we don't know if ORU reached out to the schools about any reimbursement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okiesooner Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Half of the post give me the impression that fans are blaming the conference. The other half fault the athletic department and coaches. Regardless, its's emabarrassing. It was a simple mistake and the rule broken had no malice behind it. Carter is the highest paid athletic director in the conference and should have been on top of this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 “We’re not involved outside of conference scheduling. Will we have closer scrutiny on schedules in the future? I think that’s obvious at this point,†Burnett said. “There’s a lot of rules in that 500-page NCAA book. A lot of things slip through the cracks and it’s not good for anybody. “This was the fix that we believe is our only pathway. In the future there will be a very thorough schedule certification before schools can release them publicly or play the games.†Sorry, but that's inexcusable, especially coming from the commissioner himself. How can you not go over each team's schedule with a fine tooth comb, when any impropriety (such as this one) could end up rendering your conference tournament champion ineligible for the NCAA tournament, with the subsequent loss of NCAA tournament revenue? Blaming the oversight on the number of pages in the NCAA manual borders on a "You Might Be A Redneck" joke. And to say that future due-diligence is "obvious at this point" is laughable, when what SHOULD have been done in the first place (checking the schedules) was apparently NOT obvious to those same folks in the conference office back in August. My guess? In August, everyone in that office is blinded by football. Basketball (and a lot of other sports) are more a nuisance than a priority. And this sort of fiasco is the result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Is there a minimum number of games that we have to play in the regular season? We're not walking into another hornet's nest, are we? Maybe it's up to the board to try to catch any possible infringements before they happen. Somebody has to pick up the slack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORU82 Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Our athletic department clearly missed something in this matter and therefore we are not blameless. However, I do not believe we set out to do harm to either ACU or ICW. Further, as for any "damage" we may have caused either of these two schools, let me state what I found with a little research using both ACU's and ICW's websites. ACU plays its games in an arena that has a seating capacity of 4,600. However, this season to date it has played four home games. Further after each game I have given their stated attendance according to the numbers ACU provided. They are: Hillsdale Baptist (2,146); Bacone College (Okla.) (230); Open Bible (211) and Open Bible (230) for a total attendance through four games of 2,817 or an average of 704 people per game unless you drop the Hillsdale game, and then that number drops to an average of 224 per game. Further, tickets go for $10 per adult and $5 per child. Using ACU's average attendance figures and assuming that all attending are adults, they would average making $7,040 per game. If you drop the Hillsdale Baptist attendance and use the remaing three games with the same assumption that all attending are adults, ACU would be making $2,240 per game. As for ICW, they play their games in a facility that seats 2,000 and looks like a small high school gym. As for their attendance per game, here is their information: Northwood (326); Texas A&M International (305); St. Edwards (224); McMurray (274); Open Bible (121); Open Bible (277); Huston-Tillotson (157) and Our Lady of the Lake (352) for a total attendance through eight games of 2,036 or an average of 255 per game. Their tickets also go for $10 per adult/$5 per child. Using ICW's average attendance figures and assuming all attending are adults, they would average making $2,550 per game. I give all of this information for a reason. Why would the SLC force its member institutions to play these teams while they are still considered D-II and why would any of these games be counted in league play even though neither ACU or ICW can compete at Katy? Further, why would the SLC NOT check each member's schedules to make sure there are no violations because if these were not caught in a timely fashion, any member violating the rules would forfeit its right to participate in post season play the next year meaning that if SFA or ORU or SLU had not timely made the necessary adjustments and not been permitted to play in the Big Dance next year, it would cost them seriously. I know from following one of my other alma maters that for appearing in the first round of 64 in the NCAA tourney they were paid approximately $1 MM (One Million Dollars). Thereafter through the Sweet 16 they were paid approximately $1.5 MM (One Million Five Hundred Thousand Dollars) per game. Although I may not be exact on these numbers, you begin to see how not participating in post season play could really cost a school and/or conference. Finally and no disrespect to either ACU or ICW, but why would the SLC even consider these two teams for conference membership? What exactly do either of these two schools bring to the table? Their respective attendance numbers are worse then a small high school. Actually, ICW's attendance numbers are worse then most weekend biddy league games! And, how/what do they pay us for traveling to their schools to play a game? Are we loosing our shirts going to their gyms to play? Making somewhere between $2,000 to $7,000 per game is a joke. How do you pay visiting D-I schools for that game? Why did the SLC force not only ORU but UCA, Lamar, SHS, HBU, TAMCC and ICW to go to ACU for a game this year? In the end, we should have picked up the mistake. But, I am more frustrated with the SLC for even allowing this to be an issue by forcing its member institutions to play either ACU or ICW this year. More importantly, both ACU and ICW kill not only the SLC's RPI but anyone playing them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theeagleman5 Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Good stuff, 82.....SLC, we hardly knew ye......Summit League......weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeere baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaack!!!...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bogus Smith Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 ORU82, the Southland is a football conference wannabe. IWU and UCA brought a commitment to spend millions of dollars to raise their football stature to a Division I FCS level. In the Southland, basketball is the sport played between the end of football and the beginning of spring football. Baseball is what is played when spring football is over and to shorten the time before the start of football drills again. When the basketball schedules are finalized on August 1, football is in full swing - everyone is undefeated and beating their chest on how great their team is going to be that season. As OT stated previously, basketball is an annoyance until after Thanksgiving (and possibly later if a SLC team is in the FCS playoffs). ORU's focus is basketball and baseball and, although the SLC is a great baseball conference for us, it doesn't pay as well as basketball. We will do well in a Summit League environment and continue to play baseball into June (IMHO). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORU82 Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Thanks Bogus, I completely agree with your assessment of the SLC. It was good for us in baseball, but their basketball is a joke and yes we are a basketball school. I too think we will do better in both sports in the Summit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlue82 Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 More important than "how we can compete" in a conference is... are the conference members aligned in their current focus and vision for the future. I am very confident that we can compete favorably in either the Southland or the Summit (or even in the Missouri Valley, for that matter!). The savings in travel costs and an improved geographic fit were a great draw for ORU to move to the Southland, but the alignment in focus and purpose was not there - and will be vastly improved by a return to the Summit. Should we have known this upfront? Probably, but we don't know what the sales pitch was at the time. A great business strategy is... if you're going to fail, fail quickly, cut your losses and move on... and that is exactly the action ORU has taken. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Good overview story from ESPN.com today. Pity the U. of Vermont: they've actually gone over the limit already, and must await NCAA repercussions... NCAA Rules Force Schools Into Forfeits (ESPN.com) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titan Eagle Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Old Titan and ORU82. Thank you. Great research & responses! It is sad on many levels, but I won't rehash. It even effects the staff that would have worked each game. The folks in the ivory towers don't think about how mistakes ripple down to the person putting food on their table that don't make six figures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 From Twitter: I'm hearing the NCAA may be taking care of all the teams effected by the non-DI scheduling issues this year... stay tuned.— One-Bid Wonders (@onebidwonders) January 13, 2014 What the heck does that mean? Is there some sort of possibility ORU's games with IWU and ACU could still be played? P.S. "Affect" vs. "Effect" Grammar Rules Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORUalum Posted January 13, 2014 Author Share Posted January 13, 2014 if the NCAA offers a special dispensation where the games do not have to be forfeited, the league offices in Frisco will be the hardest hit. you have to think they are taking some joy in sticking it to ORU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmh8286 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 if the NCAA offers a special dispensation where the games do not have to be forfeited, the league offices in Frisco will be the hardest hit. you have to think they are taking some joy in sticking it to ORU. What I heard in that regard is third hand, but my understanding is quite the opposite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 What I heard in that regard is third hand, but my understanding is quite the opposite. Agreed: the conference is by no means thrilled with all this, but by all indications, they've been pretty accomodating. Bottom line: they could have used this as an excuse to ban ORU from the postseason tournament, but they didn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOLO_Gold Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 Agreed: the conference is by no means thrilled with all this, but by all indications, they've been pretty accomodating. Bottom line: they could have used this as an excuse to ban ORU from the postseason tournament, but they didn't. Because there were other conference offenders we'll probably never really know what they may have wanted to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORUalum Posted January 14, 2014 Author Share Posted January 14, 2014 i think the America East petitioned the NCAA and ORU and the Southland may benefit....LINK "The Southland Conference has been provided an opportunity by the NCAA to participate in a blanket waiver submission that provides temporary relief from the requirements of Bylaw 20.9.8.1. The Division I Subcommittee for Legislative Relief is considering the appeal at the NCAA Convention this week, and while the league does not know the outcome of the request, the Conference's Executive Committee has authorized preparation to play all Thursday night men's basketball games as originally scheduled, including the Oral Roberts at Abilene Christian contest. As it relates to other possible appeal outcomes and the Conference's previous decisions on forfeiture, the Executive Committee awaits the subcommittee's final review. The Conference will have no other comment until that occurs." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORUTerry Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 Does that mean we travel to Abiliene without knowing if we can play on Thursday or not? That seems rather strange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.