theeagleman5 Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Not being able to play a Brackbuster game because of Summit League scheduling is absurd....why are we still even in this league?...what is the inside story on why we have never pursued being in the Missouri Valley?...have we ever been considered?...would we be interested?...what do ORU insiders say about it...I obviously am not close to the situation but it seems to me that we would compete favorably in Basketball and Baseball and it would be good for recruiting and national exposure..most of the schools a closer for travel purposes....what's the scoop?...am i off base on this??... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlue82 Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Not being able to play a Brackbuster game because of Summit League scheduling is absurd....why are we still even in this league?...what is the inside story on why we have never pursued being in the Missouri Valley?...have we ever been considered?...would we be interested?...what do ORU insiders say about it...I obviously am not close to the situation but it seems to me that we would compete favorably in Basketball and Baseball and it would be good for recruiting and national exposure..most of the schools a closer for travel purposes....what's the scoop?...am i off base on this??... Plain and simple....we're still in the Summit League because we haven't been invited to join any better conference. If the Valley came calling, I'm sure we would jump at the chance. But, frankly, I believe we're still a few years away from being ready for such a move. We have some "internal business" to attend to (which is currently underway), and then we should be in a position (both athletically and financially) to be a desirable affiliate for the Missouri Valley. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 For the umpteenth time: the MVC doesn't want ORU, at least not right now. There has been talk that The Valley might some day add two teams if they could convince A-10 member Saint Louis to be one of them, but there's a long list of worthy contenders, including ORU, for the other spot. Plus, Valley membership in the near future might be biting off more than we could chew financially, anyway. It would mean adding another "Tier One" women's sport, presumably softball, with the expense of building a softball stadium. It would result in a decidedly higher level of competition, meaning fewer NCAA trips for our men and women athletes than they enjoy now in the Summit League. Plus, the athletic budgets of most of The Valley schools are quite a bit more than ORU's, especially for team travel. The Summit League may not be the greatest place for ORU to stay in the long run, but for right now, it really does suit us just fine... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORUJason Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 There are many things to be thankful for in the Summit League, since it provides a great opportunity for ORU to be very competitive in every sport, and clearly in baseball for the last 10 years and basketball over the last 3 years, things have worked out very well for ORU in this league. Not improving the scheduling prior to the bracketbuster game for all of the conference participants is short-sided and illogical. I would think the same thing even if ORU was not participating. But we have had the opportunity to host baseball almost every year, and basketball for the last 4 years. Overall, the Summit League has been very good to ORU. The MVC doesn't want to expand right now, and may not ever have the need to expand, so the Summit League is definitely the best option right now for ORU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theeagleman5 Posted May 12, 2008 Author Share Posted May 12, 2008 OK...i get the message....how about the Horizon then?...would love to see us kick Valpo around again!!.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 OK...i get the message....how about the Horizon then?...would love to see us kick Valpo around again!!.... Same arguments: who would our travel partners be in scheduling men's and women's basketball? Name one school within 500 miles of Tulsa. Do you know how much it would cost for tennis or golf or soccer to travel to places like Wright State or Wisconsin-Milwaukee every time they go on the road? At least in the Summit, we have UMKC, Western Illinois and Centenary that are semi-close... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titansoccer8 Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Why would we seriously not entertain moving baseball to the MVC? Or any other more powerful conference? Or are there certain regulations that prohibit schools from moving certain sports to other conferences if their current conference offers the same sport? As much as I hate to say it, the Summit is the proper place for us now...the question is, for how long? I hope that a move is in the cards within the next three years...tops. And no offense, I think the argument that staying in a weaker conference provides greater chances of post season play is a good thing is somewhat off-base. Sure, post season appearances are nice, however, the excitement turns to disappointment quickly when it is one-and-done every year...which honestly, will most likely be the case for basketball 99% of the time. Sutton has done an incredibily nice job, however, there is no guarantee that he can continue to recruit the types of kids he has over the years and consistently be at the top of the Summit. Baseball is another story because we will always dominate the Summit...however, moving to another conference might increase the odds of us actually making it to a Super Regional if we played a tougher conference schedule... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmh8286 Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Good points, TS8. I believe that ORU had a chance to move baseball only to the MVC years ago, but if I remember the story correctly, we had just joined the Mid-Con at that point, and MC didn't feel it would be appropriate to pull baseball out of the conference at that point. I'm not sure that he would feel the same if the offer came now. I think there is strong interest in moving, but it's unlikely that there will be any changes unless there are some changes in conference affiliations, as OT explained earlier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Why would we seriously not entertain moving baseball to the MVC? Or any other more powerful conference? Or are there certain regulations that prohibit schools from moving certain sports to other conferences if their current conference offers the same sport? As much as I hate to say it, the Summit is the proper place for us now...the question is, for how long? I hope that a move is in the cards within the next three years...tops. And no offense, I think the argument that staying in a weaker conference provides greater chances of post season play is a good thing is somewhat off-base. Sure, post season appearances are nice, however, the excitement turns to disappointment quickly when it is one-and-done every year...which honestly, will most likely be the case for basketball 99% of the time. Sutton has done an incredibily nice job, however, there is no guarantee that he can continue to recruit the types of kids he has over the years and consistently be at the top of the Summit. Baseball is another story because we will always dominate the Summit...however, moving to another conference might increase the odds of us actually making it to a Super Regional if we played a tougher conference schedule... Baseball is the last sport we would want to have play in another conference - why should we? Unlike men's and women's basketball, ORU is able to schedule the very best baseball teams in the country for competitive and RPI reasons (Texas, Baylor, Arkansas, Wichita State, Rice, etc. regionally, plus the other schools in Texas, and anybody we want on the West Coast as long as we're willing to travel out there), while facing little competition within the conference in earning an NCAA berth each year - never have to worry too much about sweating out an at-large bid. Do you really think we would have earned NCAA baseball berths ten years in a row in The Valley? It's a great situation right now for baseball, other than the sucky travel and playing conditions within the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORU Eli Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Wow...it MUST be the offseason if we're getting this started up again... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titansoccer8 Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 OT... I guess it boils down to what motivates each the baseball player. I can tell you that I personally would rather play in a conference that offers far better competition than play an attractive non-conference schedule and regularly beat up on a bunch of losers like we do today. Playing a tougher conference schedule along with our usual non-conference schedule would be more attractive to top tier recruits...in my opinion. I agree that that chances of gaining automatic bids would be less, but well worth it in my opinion. Besides, the chances of the MVC placing more than one team in the NCAA's is much greater than the Summit. When players are done, they will always say, "we played against teams like WSU, Long Beach State, Arkansas, Texas, Baylor, OSU and OU"...clearly ignoring the fact that they played Centenary, Western Illinois, Oakland...I mean, why don't we just be like Nebraska and play the Little Sisters of the Poor? But hey, "we made it to the NCAA's every year, only to get beat in the Regionals." I would think kids would rather say, "yeah, we played non-conference schools like Long Beach State, Arkansas, Texas and Baylor, but we also played, competed and regularly beat conference opponents such as WSU, Creighton, MSU, Northern Iowa, etc." If we were in the MVC, I guarantee that we would finish no lower than 3rd every year...and most years we would strongly compete for the championship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 OT... I guess it boils down to what motivates each the baseball player. I can tell you that I personally would rather play in a conference that offers far better competition than play an attractive non-conference schedule and regularly beat up on a bunch of losers like we do today. Playing a tougher conference schedule along with our usual non-conference schedule would be more attractive to top tier recruits...in my opinion. I agree that that chances of gaining automatic bids would be less, but well worth it in my opinion. Besides, the chances of the MVC placing more than one team in the NCAA's is much greater than the Summit. When players are done, they will always say, "we played against teams like WSU, Long Beach State, Arkansas, Texas, Baylor, OSU and OU"...clearly ignoring the fact that they played Centenary, Western Illinois, Oakland...I mean, why don't we just be like Nebraska and play the Little Sisters of the Poor? But hey, "we made it to the NCAA's every year, only to get beat in the Regionals." I would think kids would rather say, "yeah, we played non-conference schools like Long Beach State, Arkansas, Texas and Baylor, but we also played, competed and regularly beat conference opponents such as WSU, Creighton, MSU, Northern Iowa, etc." If we were in the MVC, I guarantee that we would finish no lower than 3rd every year...and most years we would strongly compete for the championship. So what?? Just ask the players we have now why they are at ORU: to play for a coach like Rob Walton, to play the best teams whenever and wherever they will play us, and to have a shot at getting to Omaha. ORU offers all those things right now. We don't need to change conferences to accomplish any of the three. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOLO_Gold Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 Agree with you on a lot of things OT but get serious for a second - are you really saying in your most ideal illusion, you wouldn't want to see us in a better conference? The guys on here are not saying that they don't think we're in an okay situation now but "just okay" is only good for over realistic, less than heroic cowards mindsets (understand I am not calling you a coward) Just an opinion... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORUJason Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 There isn't a realistically better situation available to us right now. It was mentioned that to move to a better conference situation, ORU would have to add a couple sports, and I'm sure the athletic budget is already tapped to the max right now. If we were drawing 8,000-10,000 per each men's basketball home game, there would be more $ to work with. Mike Carter and the ORU coaches are currently maximizing their budgets and their conference affiliation with great results. I'm not sure financially (from an athletic budget standpoint) that ORU is in position to make a jump to an MVC right now. I think it is a good time to count our blessings, appreciate what we have, and keep doing everything we can to be successful to the point where others want ORU because we would be an asset to their conference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORUTerry Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 In basketball, this is league is going to be tough next year. That is for both the men and women. For the men, North Dakota State returns all of their players and they added an athletic (juco) post player. That is just what they were missing (rebounding and athleticism). IUPUI returns George Hill and most of his teammates. Oakland will have most of their players back - along with a very heralded recruiting class (three of the top Michigan prep players). We should also expect Western Illinois to improve with their new coach - Jim Molinari, the former coach at Bradley. In women's basketball, South Dakota State is already a power and will be a formidable opponent - and prohibitive conference favorite. My point is - don't sell the league short just yet. Especially since we are stuck in it for the foreseeable future. Let's hope the RPI of the league improves as our conference foes (okay, maybe not Centenary) get better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 Agree with you on a lot of things OT but get serious for a second - are you really saying in your most ideal illusion, you wouldn't want to see us in a better conference? The guys on here are not saying that they don't think we're in an okay situation now but "just okay" is only good for over realistic, less than heroic cowards mindsets (understand I am not calling you a coward) Just an opinion... ARE YOU CALLING ME A COWARD?? Seriously, as an overall athletic program, from top to bottom, financially and everything, I'm just not sure we're ready for The Valley - not yet. Maybe in five years, at our current rate of growth and success, on the field/court and in the coffers. I said the same thing about Valpo going to the Horizon, and I'm still convinced they went too early. Let's just agree to disagree... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyb Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 I don't understand why no one talks about us moving into the Sun Belt Conference. Travel's no worse than the Summit, it's definitely a better conference, they're not all football schools, and there's a decently close travel partner (UALR). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 I don't understand why no one talks about us moving into the Sun Belt Conference. Travel's no worse than the Summit, it's definitely a better conference, they're not all football schools, and there's a decently close travel partner (UALR). It's been discussed - it's actually more of a realistic destination than The Valley, but the football thing is huge deal. They really want football-playing members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.