Kudos to the Maniacs Sixth Man on Defense

[prezalum 05/06]

MVP, you've worked just as hard, if not harder, than any of us before you, no doubt in my mind.  The club hasn't grown in numbers over the last 4 years, not just this year, we sort of peaked over the last few years.  When I was the prez, the club leaders and myself actually thought we might have peaked and began discussing the next steps to grow the club.  We decided to keep doing what we had been doing, but we thought in the next couple of years there would be a larger "student section" turnout to the games, which there has been.  Those people are coming to games now, but they don't want to get dressed up in a theme, they don't necessarily want to cheer all game, they aren't concerned with going on a trip, etc.  So now the number of students at the game has increased dramatically, but the number of Maniacs is slightly down, so how do we merge the two? 

A couple of years ago, we thought the club would have to become less of a club and more of a "student section" that you see at many schools.  Everyone wears school colors, first come first serve for seats, things like that.  The true crazy fans would still get there early and would be up front to lead things, but now hopefully you can pull in more students.  When the club was created, there were no students cheering or anything like that.  The themes and the trips and all the other crazy things or incentives were all created to draw an average student who didn't care that much about the team to the game, and it worked.  We always had 10-20 die hards in the club, but the rest of the people were all average people looking to have some fun or go on a trip or something like that.  Those 10-20 guys couldn't be very effective on their own, but when you throw in another 50-100 voices along with theirs, they all of a sudden became a bit of a force! 

But now that it looks like we might have peaked, it might be time to look into merging the student section and the "Maniacs" together.  Now everyone is a Maniac, there aren't club dues, pre-game parties, club trips, etc.  I know that sucks for the current Maniacs and for the Maniac leaders, but it's probably the best way to make the student section more effective.  This would help to make the rest of the students feel more included and hopefully more likely to cheer.  Those same 10-20 die hards can still be the first ones in the Mabee and they can get all dressed up and painted and whatever, but now they aren't excluding those other students.  It was never the clubs goal to exclude, we wanted everyone to come cheer, but the pre-game in the Mezz, the club trip, all of that ended up excluding people, and while we tried our hardest to avoid that, it still happened. 

I really think that next year, the club leaders need to sit down with MM and some of the others in the Ath Dept to come up with the best way to merge this and to make a transition.  There should be a big push from the Ath Dept at the start of the year (like at the athletics chapel we always had) that the Maniacs are no longer a "club", you no longer sign up, but that the whole student section is "Maniacs", and everyone should wear ORU gear and colors.  The Ath Dept should even create Maniac gear, a couple of different shirts and head bands and wrist bands and bumper stickers, whatever, but make it available for any student to purchase.  You could have a white t-shirt and a blue t-shirt and a gold t-shirt, so that no matter the "color theme" for the night, everyone can wear their Maniac t-shirt that they can buy from the Ath Dept.  The die hard Maniacs can still show up early and get good seats and lead the cheers, but now maybe there is more of a unified effort from the student section.  As much as I loved the Maniacs the way they were, I knew this day would come, and I knew it would be better for the school and everyone involved with the team if we could unify everyone, even if you lose out on the fun we always had in the Mezz and on the club trips.  I truly believe the Ath Dept needs to step in and push really hard the next couple of years that the whole student section is called the Mabee Maniacs, maybe even put some banners up over there or something, but in order for things to improve rather than stay the same it has been lately, or even get worse in the future, then there has to be a change.  When the Maniacs were created, that was a change, and it has been part of the teams success, to a certain extent (and in no way am I claiming the Maniacs were scoring points or winning games or whatever, but we did help to create an atmostphere and a bit of a homecourt advantage!), but now I think there has to be more change in order to continue to help the team and to create a great homecourt advantage.

[meatloaf]

MVP, you've worked just as hard, if not harder, than any of us before you, no doubt in my mind.  The club hasn't grown in numbers over the last 4 years, not just this year, we sort of peaked over the last few years.  When I was the prez, the club leaders and myself actually thought we might have peaked and began discussing the next steps to grow the club.  We decided to keep doing what we had been doing, but we thought in the next couple of years there would be a larger "student section" turnout to the games, which there has been.  Those people are coming to games now, but they don't want to get dressed up in a theme, they don't necessarily want to cheer all game, they aren't concerned with going on a trip, etc.  So now the number of students at the game has increased dramatically, but the number of Maniacs is slightly down, so how do we merge the two? 

A couple of years ago, we thought the club would have to become less of a club and more of a "student section" that you see at many schools.  Everyone wears school colors, first come first serve for seats, things like that.  The true crazy fans would still get there early and would be up front to lead things, but now hopefully you can pull in more students.  When the club was created, there were no students cheering or anything like that.  The themes and the trips and all the other crazy things or incentives were all created to draw an average student who didn't care that much about the team to the game, and it worked.  We always had 10-20 die hards in the club, but the rest of the people were all average people looking to have some fun or go on a trip or something like that.  Those 10-20 guys couldn't be very effective on their own, but when you throw in another 50-100 voices along with theirs, they all of a sudden became a bit of a force! 

But now that it looks like we might have peaked, it might be time to look into merging the student section and the "Maniacs" together.  Now everyone is a Maniac, there aren't club dues, pre-game parties, club trips, etc.  I know that sucks for the current Maniacs and for the Maniac leaders, but it's probably the best way to make the student section more effective.  This would help to make the rest of the students feel more included and hopefully more likely to cheer.  Those same 10-20 die hards can still be the first ones in the Mabee and they can get all dressed up and painted and whatever, but now they aren't excluding those other students.  It was never the clubs goal to exclude, we wanted everyone to come cheer, but the pre-game in the Mezz, the club trip, all of that ended up excluding people, and while we tried our hardest to avoid that, it still happened. 

I really think that next year, the club leaders need to sit down with MM and some of the others in the Ath Dept to come up with the best way to merge this and to make a transition.  There should be a big push from the Ath Dept at the start of the year (like at the athletics chapel we always had) that the Maniacs are no longer a "club", you no longer sign up, but that the whole student section is "Maniacs", and everyone should wear ORU gear and colors.  The Ath Dept should even create Maniac gear, a couple of different shirts and head bands and wrist bands and bumper stickers, whatever, but make it available for any student to purchase.  You could have a white t-shirt and a blue t-shirt and a gold t-shirt, so that no matter the "color theme" for the night, everyone can wear their Maniac t-shirt that they can buy from the Ath Dept.  The die hard Maniacs can still show up early and get good seats and lead the cheers, but now maybe there is more of a unified effort from the student section.  As much as I loved the Maniacs the way they were, I knew this day would come, and I knew it would be better for the school and everyone involved with the team if we could unify everyone, even if you lose out on the fun we always had in the Mezz and on the club trips.  I truly believe the Ath Dept needs to step in and push really hard the next couple of years that the whole student section is called the Mabee Maniacs, maybe even put some banners up over there or something, but in order for things to improve rather than stay the same it has been lately, or even get worse in the future, then there has to be a change.  When the Maniacs were created, that was a change, and it has been part of the teams success, to a certain extent (and in no way am I claiming the Maniacs were scoring points or winning games or whatever, but we did help to create an atmostphere and a bit of a homecourt advantage!), but now I think there has to be more change in order to continue to help the team and to create a great homecourt advantage.

On this notion of the whole section being the mabee maniacs..... why not create the ORU Basketball fan club that pays the dues, and goes on the trips... no mezz, no crazy themes... just fun I know in my next 3 years here my vision is like MM's to see the students becoming more and more involved!

[vcboy2000]

VP,

This is an exciting time for you, bud. You get to be the leader that guides Maniacs Inc. through this transition in its organizational life cycle. All organizations go through it.  The University is going through it right now! You are the one that can guide The Maniacs into one of the greatest eras of fandom at ORU!  I know, like any leadership position, it is not easy. You have already sacrificed so much because you love ORU and ORU Basketball, and you are to be commended for that.  The Maniacs are such a vital part of ORU basketball now, and nobody wants to see it cease to exist. I want to let you know that you should not have to shoulder this burdon alone. Those of us out there who have come to love ORU Basketball and the Maniacs are here for you.

I want to encourage you to form a Board of Reference (thanks Mark G!) comprised of at least 5 or 7 people that have a vested interest in ORU basketball, and who could provide insight, advice, ideas, and resources to help further the organization. I would include someone from the athletic office like MM. Someone from the GEC like Terry or Doc C. A former maniac alum that is still around like Joey O, and a few others that are well versed in marketing strategies for college students. A resource team like that could prove to be invaluable to the success of the Maniacs. It shouldn't just be your problem to shoulder by yourself. The University and Athletics have benefitted from what you all do, and it's time we step up and help. What do you think?

[bballmangc]

The goal with this proposal is to make sure that the first 10 rows of the arena are full every night.  I also want to include a t-shirt with every season ticket that fans would be encouraged to wear at games or at least the same color as the free shirt.  It's hard to get people to wear exactly what you want, but maybe they will wear the right color that day at work.  I just want our crowd to be more interactive.

I don't see this getting passed at all, but I'm going to push for some type of change.

Very nice suggestions once I figured out the diagram (I am a little color blind to the yellows and greens) I think this may be the exact kind of change that the Mabee Center needs to guarantee an outstanding atmosphere at every home game.  The new students section would encourage students to come early and if all the seats were not filled would give other "crazy" fans the chance to come down and cheer with the students if they wished (like at OU games)

[bballmangc]

This is an exciting time for you, bud. You get to be the leader that guides Maniacs Inc. through this transition in its organizational life cycle. All organizations go through it.  The University is going through it right now! You are the one that can guide The Maniacs into one of the greatest eras of fandom at ORU!  I know, like any leadership position, it is not easy. You have already sacrificed so much because you love ORU and ORU Basketball, and you are to be commended for that.  The Maniacs are such a vital part of ORU basketball now, and nobody wants to see it cease to exist. I want to let you know that you should not have to shoulder this burdon alone. Those of us out there who have come to love ORU Basketball and the Maniacs are here for you.

I agree that this is a very exciting time, and change should happen soon for the increase in athletic support just as the school is making a few changes also.  If we can change now and get something implemented it may help maintain when the team may have a down year.  We will have to eventually face a coaching change and maybe even a new game philosophy change for the men's team when coach Sutton decides to move on.  So if the fans are there to support a new coach it could make the transition easier because eventually we will have a down year (we have been spoiled the last handful of years with really superb teams)

A plan should be presented and agreed on so when changes do happen everyone is behind it and ready to keep things moving in the right direction. 

[tmh8286]

MM - we get our seats in the Family Fun Zone - are you thinking you'd drop that program?

[ORU Eli]

VP...hopefully you didn't take what I said as criticism or even constructive criticism...it was definitely neither.

The only point I was trying to make is 1) just agreeing that it's hard to get people involved...sometimes even existing Maniacs...and 2) though it'd difficult you have to keep trying and finding new ways to "market" the Maniacs and ORU basketball to get as many involved as possible.

I loved having theme nights...they were awesome and so much fun but it might very well come down to where you can only have 2 or 3 a year because its hard to find more than 20-50 people that will dress up and the rest who don't dress up automatically feel excluded.

Point is, I know you have a very difficult job and there is no doubt a lot of pressure pulling you from both sides, but don't be mistaken...students...alumni...maniac alumni... we all support you and want you to succeed because what you do for the school and ORU athletics is tremendous.

Keep on keepin on.

[orumom]

MANIACS  ARE COOL--- ----MANIACS ARE FUN--- ----MANIACS ARE THE BEST----- --- ---MANIACS ARE AWESOME!!!!

Tyler is a fantastic president. He has so much heart. When I look at Joey, Gabe, and the others (sorry I just didn't get to know them as well), I get a little choked up. It is a thankless job. The only satisfaction is looking back, seeing the changes and knowing that things will NEVER BE THE SAME AGAIN!  You have made an impression in ORU history.

There are some things that are out of your control, but hopefully can be changed in the future. It starts with the recruitment of new students. I have yet to see an advertisement in the Fellowship of  Christian Athletes' publication for ORU. The last issue I saw didn't have an advertisement for a D1 school---we are missing an opportunity.  This publication reaches great Christian students when they are in the college selection stage of their lives. They already love sports, so when they go to college that shouldn't change. I have a feeling I am going to offend some people, but it is hard to involve students who have never been involved in athletics as either an athlete or a fan and whose parents don't see  the value of athletics .  Even secular publications talk about the lower rate of recreational drugs & pregnancy among student athletes vs non-athletes, because of the way sports  helps to build self esteem.

Athletics is the front porch to a lot of universities. What do you think of when someone says "Notre Dame" or "Duke"?  I know I'm preaching to the choir, but more men will read the sports  page or watch ESPN than will read the religiion section of the paper. It is a chance to say we can be Christians and not be dorks.

Those of us on this board face frustration with the fans as well. The reason ORUblue & I changed seats is that we were tired to being "told" to sit down when we would stand up and cheer. We wanted to say, "why don't you try standing up once in awhile, this isn't a movie theatre!!" but we also didn't want to loose their b_____ in the seats.  It is a fine line.

Too much caffeine, but I have a feeling I'm not through saying "how I REALLY FEEL" about this topic.

[Mike Minyard]

MM - we get our seats in the Family Fun Zone - are you thinking you'd drop that program?

Not at all.  I actually want to make a big push for the fun zone with them being $99 per seat.  The fun zone is outlined in purple starting in the sixth row in F and G and the 11th row in E.  The fun zone would not be offered in H unless you're grandfathered.  I just don't feel that the Family Fun Zone would be positioned very well behind the student section, but it would be up to you if you wanted to stay in H at the fun zone rate.

The fun zone is about the best thing we have going for us right now.  We need to market it the best we can, and I think a $99 per ticket rate would be more marketable.  Not every family needs five seats, but some only need three or four.  This way it's a fair price for every family.

[Foreternity]

I think there have been some great suggestions for change mentioned here. I love the Maniacs, but as pointed out, the vast majority of students don't want to be THAT involved in a club, and they don't want to dress up in themes. It's been great seeing less of that and more of the school colors. You can still have fun and dress somewhat crazy without looking like a pirate. In my years at ORU (just graduated last may), I knew sooo many people who love basketball and would have liked to go stand up and cheer. But one of two things prevented that. One, the student section just isn't set up well and if you weren't standing with the maniacs, there was this idea that you couldn't stand. There's a number of people that would but everyone else gets mad, so they don't.  Two, a lot of people were too embarrassed to be a maniac. They wouldn't be caught dead dressed up as a theme and some of the cheers were a bit too much (i'll come back to this at the end).  Basically, a lot of people felt (and probably still do) that either you have to be an official maniac, or you just don't get very involved.  Fact is, you can't have two competing student sections.

It seems like Tyler has made a lot of effort to begin changing this, and I am very happy to see that. It won't be easy, but I fully believe it can be done. A lot of it will come down to simply making students more aware of changes. Changing the location/size/layout of the student section can help a lot I believe. If only there was a way to change the attitudes of the non-students so that cheering more and standing was acceptable! 

But back to the cheer part. The majority of cheers are great, no problem. Some however, just aren't working so great. It's always been that way, nothing new. They may be funny, but when others hear them, they just kinda sound stupid. I don't mean any disrespect at all, just being honest. Plus, some are too involved that no one outside of the maniacs can understand them at all, which completely eliminates the effectiveness. This is another reason for less student involvement. It gets really hard to understand from behind so other students just stay quiet. My suggestion is to stick to simple, fun, easy to understand cheers. 

[Old Titan]

A question:  can any student come down on the floor for when the team comes running out of the locker room before the introductins, or do you have to be dressed up like a Maniac?

For that matter, can anyone come down on the floor for when the team runs out?  (Space permitting, of course - maybe we could do it on our end that we warm up on, in front of the band) 

I for one would kind of get a kick out of going down there before the anthem and slapping high-fives with the guys as they emerge onto the floor.

I mean, who can forget this, old-timers?  "HEY, COACH TRICKEY!!  OPEN THE DOOR!!  BRING THOSE TITANS OUT ON THE FLOOR!!

[orumom]

I for one would kind of get a kick out of going down there before the anthem and slapping high-fives with the guys as they emerge onto the floor.

I mean, who can forget this, old-timers?  "HEY, COACH TRICKEY!!  OPEN THE DOOR!!  BRING THOSE TITANS OUT ON THE FLOOR!!

OT, thanks for the memories!    Some of our best memories are when MM was small and would be on ORUblue's shoulders when the team ran through the line of fans on the floor giving the kids high fives!   

It would be great if we could do that again.

[orumom]

CULTURE CHANGE - NO NEED TO FEAR......CULTURE CHANGE - NO NEED TO FEAR..........CULTURE CHANGE. - NO NEED TO FEAR.........CULTURE CHANGE - NO NEED TO FEAR..........CULTURE CHANGE -  ..........CULTURE CHANGE -  ........CULTURE CHANGE -  .......CULTURE CHANGE -  .........CULTURE CHANGE............

A family with triplets sat next to us at Saturday night's game. While we visited, the mother said that they would love to come to all of the ORU games if it were only $5 per game per family member. (While they were there, they bought concessions for the whole family as well) We talked about the expense for a young family to attend any event where it averages $10 to $25 per person. By the time they add concessions & maybe a t-shirt they are way over $100 every time. Not a lot of young families can afford that several times per month.

These are words from her mouth, "We didn't go to ORU, but we would love for our children to. Bringing them to the games when they are this young (7) and having this much fun will help them decide where they want to go to college. We would just like to be able to bring them more often."

THIS IS A CULTURE CHANGE!  With all of the other changes at ORU, this seems like a perfect time to throw in a few more changes.   

[OKC Eagle]

Whatever else happens, we HAVE to make available affordable tickets somewhere in the Mabee Center for the families orumom is talking about.  There are too many empty seats and too much unsold concessions to do otherwise.  I have friends who are eager to go to a game anytime I give them my tickets, but they are not going to go pay $17 per seat for their family of 4.

I also have fond memories as a kid lining up on the court before the game and having the team run through the crowd to the middle of the floor.  You have a lot more time to get people on and off than the YMCA timeout and that works.

[meatloaf]

Whatever else happens, we HAVE to make available affordable tickets somewhere in the Mabee Center for the families orumom is talking about.  There are too many empty seats and too much unsold concessions to do otherwise.  I have friends who are eager to go to a game anytime I give them my tickets, but they are not going to go pay $17 per seat for their family of 4.

I also have fond memories as a kid lining up on the court before the game and having the team run through the crowd to the middle of the floor.  You have a lot more time to get people on and off than the YMCA timeout and that works.

The more and more i see Mike's plan, the more and more I think it is flawless..... sure some people may have to move their seats.... but it will lead to more seats in the stands, and when that happens, the real money is made at the concession stand...... More seats in the stands lead to more money, if you have to lower prices to do it.... it will also help Maniac involvement even charge students $5 a year to get in the game... i mean if you cant come up with 5 dollars for 15 games.... i have no answer for you

[Mike Minyard]

The more and more i see Mike's plan, the more and more I think it is flawless..... sure some people may have to move their seats.... but it will lead to more seats in the stands, and when that happens, the real money is made at the concession stand...... More seats in the stands lead to more money, if you have to lower prices to do it.... it will also help Maniac involvement even charge students $5 a year to get in the game... i mean if you cant come up with 5 dollars for 15 games.... i have no answer for you

I put the new seating chart together the same night of the IUPUI game.  I left the Mabee Center extremely frustrated even with us getting the huge win.  I became borderline depressed after watching the replay on TV.  Our student-athletes deserve a better atmosphere than what the Mabee Center is providing right now.  So the new seating chart was the result of my extremely frustrating night.  Games don't get a whole lot bigger than the Thursday game, and that was about the best I could do for a Thursday night.  So the only thing left is to shift the location of where people sit.  We really need to manipulate the seating structure so we give off a better image on television.  I also think the new seating chart would give us a chance for the student body excitement to rub off on the regular fans.  We need a more vocal crowd, and I believe my new seating chart is the answer.

I thought we had a very good crowd on Thursday night, but watching the replay made me feel like I should quit or be fired.  The crowd was fantastic on one side, but anyone watching our game on TV thought we were a joke if they understood how big a game it was that night.  We didn't do ourselves any favors by having that poor of a perceived product on TV.  That didn't get anyone excited to see ORU basketball.  Now if we moved our student section down there to those seats... now that might get someone excited.  The students are going to be more excited knowing they have a chance for a front row seat.  Right now they just know that they are going to just get a regular seat like everyone else.  I just don't think we are putting our best foot forward when we are on television.  What recruit was "wowed" when they watched our IUPUI game on TV???  It just looked terrible!

It will need some work I'm sure in order to make certain people happy.  Time will tell...

[ORUTex]

We really need to manipulate the seating structure so we give off a better image on television.

I just don't think we are putting our best foot forward when we are on television.  What recruit was "wowed" when they watched our IUPUI game on TV???  It just looked terrible!

You are absolutely right.  This needs to happen ASAP.  With all the games now available on SummitTV (when it works), it's even more important.

[Dr. Cornelius]

I put the new seating chart together the same night of the IUPUI game.   I left the Mabee Center extremely frustrated even with us getting the huge win.  I became borderline depressed after watching the replay on TV.  Our student-athletes deserve a better atmosphere than what the Mabee Center is providing right now.  So the new seating chart was the result of my extremely frustrating night.  Games don't get a whole lot bigger than the Thursday game, and that was about the best I could do for a Thursday night.  So the only thing left is to shift the location of where people sit.  We really need to manipulate the seating structure so we give off a better image on television.   I also think the new seating chart would give us a chance for the student body excitement to rub off on the regular fans.  We need a more vocal crowd, and I believe my new seating chart is the answer.

I thought we had a very good crowd on Thursday night, but watching the replay made me feel like I should quit or be fired.  The crowd was fantastic on one side, but anyone watching our game on TV thought we were a joke if they understood how big a game it was that night.  We didn't do ourselves any favors by having that poor of a perceived product on TV.  That didn't get anyone excited to see ORU basketball.  Now if we moved our student section down there to those seats... now that might get someone excited.  The students are going to be more excited knowing they have a chance for a front row seat.  Right now they just know that they are going to just get a regular seat like everyone else.  I just don't think we are putting our best foot forward when we are on television.  What recruit was "wowed" when they watched our IUPUI game on TV???  It just looked terrible!

It will need some work I'm sure in order to make certain people happy.   Time will tell...

Agree with Meatloaf. This needs to happen. It would accomplish 3 major points:

[*:3q8h3fsr]Look better on broadcast.
[*:3q8h3fsr]Draw in more student participation.
[*:3q8h3fsr]Ultimately make Mabee louder and a more lively environment/harder place to win.
[*:3q8h3fsr]