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Schedule 22-23


Keenan Henderson
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9 hours ago, ORU40 said:

I think the AD may be trying to sell the Brooklyn bridge, we can schedule top teams if we want to. We will of course have to travel, but there is no way any power 5 school is afraid to play us, and the AD saying Duke wont play us because we "are too good" is laugh out loud funny/ridiculous!!!

IMHO its the AD not doing everything needed to get it done! I played 2 years at ORU and granted it was few years ago, but AD's Bob Brooks and Larry Cochell with the basketball coach's got the best teams in the country on ORU's schedule. Most were home and homes ( one year played at the Mabee and one year at their place) and some we only played at their place, but if you want to play the best you may have to do it on their terms( that's what Anyone, Anytime, Anyplace means), but it can be done.

Over just my 2 seasons our OOC games included: Home and Home- Texas, Texas A & M, Oklahoma St., Kansas St., Tulsa. Home only- LSU. Road games only- Kansas, North Carolina, UCLA, Arkansas, San Diego St., Bradley. That's almost 20 OOC games against the best teams in the country in just 2 seasons, and I'm sure everyone on this board has memories of the teams during their time on campus playing top competition!! 

That fantastic sweet 16 run is now 2 seasons ago, if we want to stay relevant in college basketball and continue to grow our program we need to play and occasionally beat the big boys, nothing helps keep the attendance up and student & local interest like beating a Texas or Okla St.!! It has to be a priority, we need the full university committed; the president, AD and coaches.  

ORU basketball has a long, proud history of playing the best- anytime, anywhere! We need to get back to that, the AD/program needs to stop making these weak/not believable excuses and get it done!!

Thank you, ORU40 - you saved me a lot of typing that might have come across to some as self-serving, based on my connections to your and my father’s times at ORU. 

There are so many ways to skin the cat when it comes to scheduling; things like relationships with opposing coaches, the desire to play in particular recruiting grounds, and fear of the embarrassing blowout on the road are just three of many factors that can weigh into the scheduling process. 

I can’t blame any AD for “spinning” the bad news of not being able to put together an attractive schedule. But that doesn’t change the fact that if what they’re trying now on the scheduling front isn’t working, then they need to try a different approach.

It’s just like recruiting, graduating players, the W-L record, etc. - tired excuses about lack of results (and making it sound like there’s nothing that can be done about it) coming from the AD or the coaches when you’re the highest-paid staff in school history is weak sauce. 

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1 hour ago, GoldenEagleFan said:

Are you willing to put $80,000+ on it if you’re a Power 5 AD?

It's been a pretty good bet over the past decade+. You have to go back all the way until before 2011 before you would see some evidence to the contrary.

You can't say "Well, P5 programs are just afraid to schedule us" but then not have any wins to back that assertion up. If ORU was winning consistently on the road then yes that would make sense.

In the end I think ORU will have some road P5 games on the schedule.

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11 minutes ago, Dr. Cornelius said:

In the end I think ORU will have some road P5 games on the schedule.

I agree! And I hope ORU starts to win a few! Because once they do, it will REALLY be a challenge to schedule 😂

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Scheduling in today’s environment has all kinds of considerations:

  • Home games:  getting a good (P6) team to visit the Mabee Center would mean a 2-1 or 3-1 arrangement - which would diminish or negate the money received. A more reasonable strategy would seem to be setting up home & home contracts with comparable schools in the region (Central Ark, UALR, Mo St, North TX, TX-Arlington, etc). Some of these schools may not want us gaining exposure in their recruiting area. Maybe a creative approach would work: regional tournament, like minded schools (Abilene Christian, Liberty, Grand Canyon, etc).
     
  • Away games:  a large portion of our basketball budget is derived from playing P6 schools on the road. The athletic department and coaches are motivated to find (and play) these games. The schools/coaches booking these games expect you to come in and take your loss along with the check. If they think there is a chance of losing and trying explain that to their fan base, they aren’t going to sign the deal. ORU needs these games (4-5) for financial reasons but we are at their mercy in terms of contracts. TCU tried to back out last year but we held them to the contract. 
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20 hours ago, GoldenEagleFan said:

Sometimes it surprises me when I read things from people that actually played college basketball. I know it’s hard for some of the “diehard” fans to realize, but coaches don’t schedule games to appease fans in a certain geographical region. Coaches schedule games that A) they can win, and B) don’t break the bank on travel costs. Which explains why teams would much rather schedule regionally (ie: Arkansas, OU, OSU, Wichita State, TCU) than use money out of their paycheck to fund airlines tickets, hotel and food in order to travel a farther distance. 

I have to respectfully disagree with you GoldenEagleFan,  using your 2 reasons for scheduling, why would we play anybody but NAIA teams at home?? All wins and no travel costs!! Games are scheduled for many other reasons, 1). Money- being one of the main reasons- P5 road games pay very well and provide a large portion of mid-major athletic dept. budgets, and you also want good home games so attendance is up which generates not just gate revenue, but corporate partnerships and merchandise sales and donations to the university and even admission application increases.  2). Recruiting, you want to play where your recruits and their families can see you. 3). Coaches will absolutely schedule in a geographical region for the fan base, particularly for large financial supports of the program or an area where several current players are from. Also program recognition, a college team is always trying to build it's brand. 

Just for the record, playing a road game that's 250 miles away is only slightly less costly then playing a game 1500 miles away. The only cost difference is the airfare. Hotel, food, per diem money, and the ground transportation costs once there are the same and if it's the difference between playing another mid major for little $ or a P5 team for a big fat check its a no brainer! 

 

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29 minutes ago, ORU40 said:

Just for the record, playing a road game that's 250 miles away is only slightly less costly then playing a game 1500 miles away. The only cost difference is the airfare. Hotel, food, per diem money, and the ground transportation costs once there are the same and if it's the difference between playing another mid major for little $ or a P5 team for a big fat check its a no brainer! 

Not true. Teams have to spend another night after the game instead of being able to bus back immediately after the game, as red eye flights are not available. This causes teams to pay for another night of hotel and more meals… adding the cost of airline tickets for a travel party of 20+, multiple nights at a hotel for a travel party of 20+, plus more meals for everyone in the party.

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1 hour ago, GoldenEagleFan said:

Not true. Teams have to spend another night after the game instead of being able to bus back immediately after the game, as red eye flights are not available. This causes teams to pay for another night of hotel and more meals… adding the cost of airline tickets for a travel party of 20+, multiple nights at a hotel for a travel party of 20+, plus more meals for everyone in the party.

Sorry for the confusion, I was saying the only cost difference between a road trip that is a 1 hour flight away versus a 3 hour flight is the additional airfare. And yes it's always the same for OOC road trips, fly in the day before the game-practice with an early lights out, have your shoot around and meeting/film, pre-game meal as a team on game day then play the game- stay the night and fly out first thing the following morning- it's the same no matter how far the flight. I cant imagine we are bussing to more then a game or 2 per season, at least I hope not!!  

If we are passing up good non-conference road games because it's too far to bus to, then we have bigger problems than I thought!!!

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Getting back to the here & now of the 2022-23 schedule:

  • Road game at Tulsa
  • Road game at Oklahoma State
  • Road game at Texas-Arlington (if this tweet from a year ago is still accurate)
  • Presumably 2-3 games in the Mabee Center vs. non-D1 opponents, per Paul Mills scheduling philosophy (they don't weaken your NET rating since they're not included, but they bolster the W-L record presuming you take care of business as expected).
  • 18 conference games

That's 23 or 24 games right there; looking for 4-5 more D1 opponents for a minimum schedule of 28 games, which is about all Mills has scheduled since COVID.

The big question for us typical season ticket buyers, and any potential ones:  whether there will be ANY non-conference home games other than the non-D1's...

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My guess is the Central Arkansas game will return to Mabee Center? Thanks OT for compiling. Hoping for some good additions 🤞🏼

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It would be nice for the Eagles to start the year with a home game.  As you said Golden Eagle Fan, UCA would be a good one.  Thinking back to the last few years when ORU started on the road, and got blasted (Colorado State and Missouri come to mind) by about 30 points.  Let's not have that happen again.

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 5/8/2022 at 9:06 PM, GoldenEagleFan said:

My guess is the Central Arkansas game will return to Mabee Center? Thanks OT for compiling. Hoping for some good additions 🤞🏼

 

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I’m hearing rumors (that I’ve been asked not to elaborate on) about a regional D1 foe visiting the Mabee Center after all this season, and it’s not a one-off buy game either.

If it works out, it will serve as a prime example that lots of schools, big or small, good or mediocre, are having trouble scheduling games.

 

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4 hours ago, ORUalum said:

 

Good news:  MSU is not the mystery opponent I was referencing.

So that would mean THREE D1 non-conference home opponents this season:  Missouri State, Central Arkansas, and the rumored opponent I’m referencing (which is a bigger name both regionally and nationally). 

Schedule is shaping up nicely!

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Scheduling can sometimes be difficult for schools like ORU but those road games against quality D1 is what pays for the budget. I know of many of times the coaches would call a bigger school like Texas and they would start laughing and say no thank you we will schedule a North TX or someone local that we will pay less and less risk. This is from the Caleb Green years. 

For example the coaches would all sit down and go over the budget and the head coach would say ok we need 3 to 4 games on the road to get to this number. The assistant coach in charge of scheduling will start getting on the phone with contacts and see what games he can get on his own. Maybe the head coach will have to make a call to ask for a favor and get one scheduled. They always got to the number needed but wasn't easy for sure. 

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TheEagleman is hoping that "mystery opponent" is Wichita State or perhaps North Texas.......:circle-logoi:

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For those of you who know how these things work. What is the motivation for a non-conference mid level or bigger D1 school to come to ORU and play? Is it money? Certainly, we can't pay them what they (the P5 type schools) pay us to come to their place. Glad the schedule is seeming to look better than last year. Just interested to know how we lure higher level competition to come to Mabee Center. Thanks for the input.

 

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I'm gonna guess Kansas State, with new head coach Jerome Tang. It would be a nice match up with the two former Baylor assistants.

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1 hour ago, theeagleman5 said:

TheEagleman is hoping that "mystery opponent" is Wichita State or perhaps North Texas.......:circle-logoi:

Wichita State would be a huge get for us. I don't know how realistic that is, though - why would they come here with all that Koch money floating around up there? North Texas is a good bet, though I don't know that they're a bigger name "regionally and nationally" than MSU. What a confusing riddle Old Titan is laying out for us to solve.

Any chance TU is going to come see us in addition to the game at their place? When was the last time we played them twice in one season? 

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21 minutes ago, ORUIllini said:

I'm gonna guess Kansas State, with new head coach Jerome Tang. It would be a nice match up with the two former Baylor assistants.

pretty sure i saw Scott Drew say in an interview that he and his former assistants don't schedule one another

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Come on, Scott....show some stones!!!...schedule ORU....your buddy Paul Mills will even give you 2 for 1.....:hc_mills:

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I can’t blame Scott Drew.  I wouldn’t want to either.  When Scott Sutton beat Sean Sutton on ESPN around Christmas break many years ago, it was the beginning of the end for Sean.  I am sure that was a bittersweet moment for Scott and his parents.

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I’m sorry guys, I never intended to tease this thing; I was just trying to assure everyone the home non-conference slate wasn’t going to be as bad as it appeared a few weeks back. 

So in the interest of not letting the speculation run rampant, I feel obligated to say it’s not a P5 team, so don’t get your hopes up!

Because Dave is right:  there’s hardly any motivation for a P5 team to play ORU in the Mabee Center except the following:  

  • Providing local alumni a chance to see their alma mater (i.e. OU, OSU, and Arkansas).
  • Providing their fans a road opponent within driving distance (in recent seasons Missouri is the only one I can think of)
  • Making good on promises made to blue chip recruits from the Tulsa area (such as Dean Smith and North Carolina coming to Tulsa on behalf of Jenks product Steve Hale).
  • As a favor between coaches (Texas Tech and New Mexico came to the Mabee Center due to Scott Sutton’s relationship with members of their coaching staffs).

Aside from that, there’s no way to get ‘em here:  nothing to gain in their eyes, and plenty to lose.

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The only way to get better teams to come to the Mabee Center is to become dominant. By dominant I mean to rule the Summit League for a number of years and win away from home on a semi-consistent basis at big name schools, the same way Gonzaga and Creighton have done it. That is how they built their reputation. It looks like that is what Coach Mills is trying to do. More power to him. If we can do that, other teams will pick up the phone when we call them because there will be more value in playing us. If they win in Tulsa it is a great win. And if they lose, it isn't a bad loss. Plus, we will be the bigger draw in town and should have higher attendance numbers. But first, we have to put our big boy pants on and crush the SL and win more than 1 or 2 money games away from home. Who knows, if that happens we may even be able to rid ourselves of the Dakota league and join the MVC or one similar that would bring outstanding competition in on a more regular basis. That would benefit all of our programs, especially baseball. Baseball, even more than basketyball, simply have to get out of the Summit League if they are ever going to be a great program.

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100% correct Dave! I wish it wern't  so but until we get close to the top 25 we are too much of a liability for top tier teams to contend with. I have been told first hand that the good teams don't want to play a team especially at home that can stay within 15 points. In talking with Kareem Thompson the other day I asked him thus far what is the main difference between this year's team and last. He quickly said that this year we don't have a weak player! This could present a challenge we have not had in many years which is keeping players happy with the amount of minutes they play. I am so grateful ORU is not choosing to stay status quo but go through the growing pains and become a powerhouse! Growing up in Spokane I witnessed first hand the trying transition Gonzaga made from NAIA to D1 and then becoming a powerhouse. It takes time but can be done!

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