Biggest wins in ORU history

[Cletus]

8 minutes ago, jmg1984 said:

Saw Ken's last win over UT Pan American was there to also see Sam Perkins and had a big bonus of seeing Mike TU upset NC though

Yes, I remember that tournament. Before the games, a group of us from the wing Fortress went to the Mabee to watch the North Carolina Tar Heels practice. Michael Jordan was there and the team with Coach Dean Smith.

Sam Perkins walked in late to practice and Smith bawled him out. Coach Smith made him sit in yellow seats to watch practice. 

[dave]

Ah, a Fortress reference. That was my wing for all four years, 1976-1980. I was a music major that much preferred to be on an athletic wing and play intramural sports than hang out at Timko-Barton. Great memories.

[theeagleman5]

Fortress a nice wing but no Youngblood, my friend....

[Keenan Henderson]

13 minutes ago, dave said:

Ah, a Fortress reference. That was my wing for all four years, 1976-1980. I was a music major that much preferred to be on an athletic wing and play intramural sports than hang out at Timko-Barton. Great memories.

Somewhat off post but did you guys play a lot of intramural sports at ORU?  I was 6'0 and 130 pounds soaking wet at ORU, so tennis and racquetball was more my speed!

[theeagleman5]

TheEagleman was no athlete but played Football, Basketball and Softball intramurals.....Youngblood had a lot of really good young kids that first year in 1973-74 and have heard they carry on that tradition......I donated my #84 jersey to them back about 12-13 years ago and as far as I know it still hangs on the wall at 5 Yellow.....the boys were kind enough to send me a brand new version of the Youngblood jersey with my name and #84 on it.....I still have it in my closet.....

[jmg1984]

2 hours ago, Cletus said:

Yes, I remember that tournament. Before the games, a group of us from the wing Fortress went to the Mabee to watch the North Carolina Tar Heels practice. Michael Jordan was there and the team with Coach Dean Smith.

Sam Perkins walked in late to practice and Smith bawled him out. Coach Smith made him sit in yellow seats to watch practice. 

That must have been awesome!

[jmg1984]

1 hour ago, Keenan Henderson said:

Somewhat off post but did you guys play a lot of intramural sports at ORU?  I was 6'0 and 130 pounds soaking wet at ORU, so tennis and racquetball was more my speed!

6'5" 185 Volleyball and a lot of basketball A league

[dave]

My favorite intramural sport was volleyball. I had never played until Jim Selby asked me to tryout. Fell in love with the sport. Also played basketball but on the B team.

[Bogus Smith]

11 hours ago, Cletus said:

How about the controversial Ken Hayes firing at Christmas break? In I believe 1981, Hayes was fired after starting 3-6 and Dick Acres was hired. When the students came back in 1982, ORU played Kansas with Ted Owens as their coach at the Mabee Center. The ORU players said they were not going to play because Hayes was fired. Eventually. most of the players were convinced to come back (the story was on the national news). 

My memory of the game on January 6th was that ORU was losing most of the time and tied it at the end (which was remarkable). ORU goes on to win in overtime with a last second pass to a wide open Mark Acres under the basket and he lays it up and the team wins. I can still see the basket in my mind.

(Maybe @Old Titan can help me with some of these details, Chris Cantrell and others).

Read here>>>ORU Players Boycott

Just as Kansas was shocked, I know many people in the Mabee Center were shocked. That win should have never happened! I recall that certain players were not allowed to play or start because they more than rebelled against the decision that was made. 

I remember someone jokingly prophesying on the wing that ORU would win. Oral gave a big speech in chapel telling the students to show up at the game and cheer on the team, even though this firing happened. 

Between the City of Faith and the basketball team, ORU thrived on controversy in those days. 

The BIGGEST mistake ORU ever made in its intercollegiate history is to fire Ken Hayes during the Christmas holidays.  Regardless of the win the first game back with Kansas, the firing set the basketball program into a tailspin that it never really recovered from until the Sweet 16 in 2021 - almost 40 years in the wilderness.

I remember Mike Gottfried came to play for Ken as he was close friends with Mark's dad, who was an AD at another school.  Gottfried's dad and Coach Hayes convinced Mark to return for the second semester and then transfer the next year (which he did - playing for the Crimson Tide at Alabama).  Ted Owens lost his HC job at Kansas in 1983, in part, due to the loss at ORU on that January night.  Two years later, in 1985, Ted would be named the new HC at ORU for a tough, two-year stint, including taking over as AD from Larry Cochell in 1986.

A friend of ours (and teammate of ORU40), Brian Miles, recounts the fact that he was recruited by Ken Hayes, coached by Hayes for a semester ('82), Dick Acres ('83-'85) and Ted Owens ('85-'87) during his career at ORU - all with distinct coaching approaches.  Brian was a Reggie Clemens-type of post player (small and built) but was not a shot blocker.  He still ended up playing in Europe for a few years as did many players from those teams - Maurice Smith, Kendall Mack, and the NBA (Mark Acres & Haywoode Workman). We still had some decent players through that period of time.

[jmg1984]

8 minutes ago, Bogus Smith said:

The BIGGEST mistake ORU ever made in its intercollegiate history is to fire Ken Hayes during the Christmas holidays.  Regardless of the win the first game back with Kansas, the firing set the basketball program into a tailspin that it never really recovered from until the Sweet 16 in 2021 - almost 40 years in the wilderness.

I remember Mike Gottfried came to play for Ken as he was close friends with Mark's dad, who was an AD at another school.  Gottfried's dad and Coach Hayes convinced Mark to return for the second semester and then transfer the next year (which he did - playing for the Crimson Tide at Alabama).  Ted Owens lost his HC job at Kansas in 1983, in part, due to the loss at ORU on that January night.  Two years later, in 1985, Ted would be named the new HC at ORU for a tough, two-year stint, including taking over as AD from Larry Cochell in 1986.

A friend of ours (and teammate of ORU40), Brian Miles, recounts the fact that he was recruited by Ken Hayes, coached by Hayes for a semester ('82), Dick Acres ('83-'85) and Ted Owens ('85-'87) during his career at ORU - all with distinct coaching approaches.  Brian was a Reggie Clemens-type of post player (small and built) but was not a shot blocker.  He still ended up playing in Europe for a few years as did many players from those teams - Maurice Smith, Kendall Mack, and the NBA (Mark Acres & Haywoode Workman). We still had some decent players through that period of time.

Miles didn't come to ORU until 1983 A 3 star out of Indiana.  You Mean Reggie Clement class of 1983?

[Bogus Smith]

Yes....you're correct jmg1984.  Brian was recruited by Hayes, but never played for him.

[ORU40]

12 hours ago, Bogus Smith said:

The BIGGEST mistake ORU ever made in its intercollegiate history is to fire Ken Hayes during the Christmas holidays.  Regardless of the win the first game back with Kansas, the firing set the basketball program into a tailspin that it never really recovered from until the Sweet 16 in 2021 - almost 40 years in the wilderness.

I have to respectfully disagree Bogus, having played the 2 years immediately following the firing of coach Hayes we were far from in a tailspin or in the wilderness. Were some people unhappy with coach Hayes being fired; of course, particularly the timing being right before Christmas. Coach Hayes was a great guy, no one that met him would say otherwise, but even at ORU college basketball is a business and Oral didn't think coach Hayes was going to get the program where he thought it should be, so he made a change. But we were very successful and played in front of large, enthusiastic Mabee crowds with very good local media, local fan and student support. We played in a great conference (winning 1 regular season championship and 1 conf tourney championship w/NCAA bid and one conf tourney runner-up)  and played a national non-conference schedule and over those 2 seasons probably the toughest non-conference and overall schedule ORU has ever played. Over that 2-year period we played in 7 win or go home games and won 5 of them.

We played the best teams in the country (North Carolina, Kansas, UCLA, Arkansas, LSU, Memphis St., Xavier, etc.) against the best coaches (Dean Smith, Eddie Sutton, Larry Brown, Nolan Richardson, etc.) and the best players (Brad Daughtry, Kenny Smith, Reggie Miller, Joe Klien, Michael Cage, Jerry "Ice" Reynolds, Stevie Harris, Keith Lee and William Bedford, just some of the 1st round picks we played in that 2-year period!!)   we won a lot of games beating Ok St., Texas, Texas A &M, Xavier, Loyola of Chicago. We lost some close games to very good teams but were competitive with anyone in the country!! We also had 3 players picked in the NBA draft (all 3 played in the NBA or over overseas). ORU basketball was on the national map!

The NAIA years were the programs low point and definitely the wilderness, but in 1988-89 we had maybe our best back court ever with Greg Sutton and Hayward Workman (of course Woosie and Duggar would get a lot of votes from the old timers).  I doubt Caleb Green and Ken Tutt or anyone else involved with ORU basketball on the bus ride home after just beating KU in "the Phog" or hearing ORU called on those tourney selection Sunday's thought the program was in the wilderness. 

My point is, we did eventually have some down years between Ken Hayes and the sweet 16, but not right away and you definitely can't just lump them all together, we were absolutely not in a tailspin for 40 years!! Often far from it, as during that time we had some excellent teams that were very successful and some outstanding players!! We actually played in more NCAA tournaments during the "wilderness years" then before or after... combined!!!

 

 

[Old Titan]

As some of you can appreciate, the Ken Hayes firing is a difficult topic for personal reasons, but I want to elaborate on the "1983 tailspin" angle from the 30,000-foot view that hindsight affords.

The timing of the firing was egregious in terms of coming during the Christmas holidays, but in the bigger picture the move was made MUCH worse due to the economic downturn in the oil & gas industry in Oklahoma at the time, and how that affected Tulsa's business climate.

The combination of big-money corporate season ticket buyers being turned-off by the Hayes firing, plus not having the same kind of budget as in the '70's for their entertainment and sponsorship efforts, AND the overnight success of Nolan Richardson at TU, resulted in ORU season ticket sales plummeting in the early '80's from heights they have not even remotely approached since.

[jmg1984]

46 minutes ago, ORU40 said:

I have to respectfully disagree Bogus, having played the 2 years immediately following the firing of coach Hayes we were far from in a tailspin or in the wilderness. Were some people unhappy with coach Hayes being fired; of course, particularly the timing being right before Christmas. Coach Hayes was a great guy, no one that met him would say otherwise, but even at ORU college basketball is a business and Oral didn't think coach Hayes was going to get the program where he thought it should be, so he made a change. But we were very successful and played in front of large, enthusiastic Mabee crowds with very good local media, local fan and student support. We played in a great conference (winning 1 regular season championship and 1 conf tourney championship w/NCAA bid and one conf tourney runner-up)  and played a national non-conference schedule and over those 2 seasons probably the toughest non-conference and overall schedule ORU has ever played. Over that 2-year period we played in 7 win or go home games and won 5 of them.

We played the best teams in the country (North Carolina, Kansas, UCLA, Arkansas, LSU, Memphis St., Xavier, etc.) against the best coaches (Dean Smith, Eddie Sutton, Larry Brown, Nolan Richardson, etc.) and the best players (Brad Daughtry, Kenny Smith, Reggie Miller, Joe Klien, Michael Cage, Jerry "Ice" Reynolds, Stevie Harris, Keith Lee and William Bedford, just some of the 1st round picks we played in that 2-year period!!)   we won a lot of games beating Ok St., Texas, Texas A &M, Xavier, Loyola of Chicago. We lost some close games to very good teams but were competitive with anyone in the country!! We also had 3 players picked in the NBA draft (all 3 played in the NBA or over overseas). ORU basketball was on the national map!

The NAIA years were the programs low point and definitely the wilderness, but in 1988-89 we had maybe our best back court ever with Greg Sutton and Hayward Workman (of course Woosie and Duggar would get a lot of votes from the old timers).  I doubt Caleb Green and Ken Tutt or anyone else involved with ORU basketball on the bus ride home after just beating KU in "the Phog" or hearing ORU called on those tourney selection Sunday's thought the program was in the wilderness. 

My point is, we did eventually have some down years between Ken Hayes and the sweet 16, but not right away and you definitely can't just lump them all together, we were absolutely not in a tailspin for 40 years!! Often far from it, as during that time we had some excellent teams that were very successful and some outstanding players!! We actually played in more NCAA tournaments during the "wilderness years" then before or after... combined!!!

 

 

Truth!!!!

[Bogus Smith]

3 hours ago, ORU40 said:

I have to respectfully disagree Bogus, having played the 2 years immediately following the firing of coach Hayes we were far from in a tailspin or in the wilderness. Were some people unhappy with coach Hayes being fired; of course, particularly the timing being right before Christmas. Coach Hayes was a great guy, no one that met him would say otherwise, but even at ORU college basketball is a business and Oral didn't think coach Hayes was going to get the program where he thought it should be, so he made a change. But we were very successful and played in front of large, enthusiastic Mabee crowds with very good local media, local fan and student support. We played in a great conference (winning 1 regular season championship and 1 conf tourney championship w/NCAA bid and one conf tourney runner-up)  and played a national non-conference schedule and over those 2 seasons probably the toughest non-conference and overall schedule ORU has ever played. Over that 2-year period we played in 7 win or go home games and won 5 of them.

We played the best teams in the country (North Carolina, Kansas, UCLA, Arkansas, LSU, Memphis St., Xavier, etc.) against the best coaches (Dean Smith, Eddie Sutton, Larry Brown, Nolan Richardson, etc.) and the best players (Brad Daughtry, Kenny Smith, Reggie Miller, Joe Klien, Michael Cage, Jerry "Ice" Reynolds, Stevie Harris, Keith Lee and William Bedford, just some of the 1st round picks we played in that 2-year period!!)   we won a lot of games beating Ok St., Texas, Texas A &M, Xavier, Loyola of Chicago. We lost some close games to very good teams but were competitive with anyone in the country!! We also had 3 players picked in the NBA draft (all 3 played in the NBA or over overseas). ORU basketball was on the national map!

The NAIA years were the programs low point and definitely the wilderness, but in 1988-89 we had maybe our best back court ever with Greg Sutton and Hayward Workman (of course Woosie and Duggar would get a lot of votes from the old timers).  I doubt Caleb Green and Ken Tutt or anyone else involved with ORU basketball on the bus ride home after just beating KU in "the Phog" or hearing ORU called on those tourney selection Sunday's thought the program was in the wilderness. 

My point is, we did eventually have some down years between Ken Hayes and the sweet 16, but not right away and you definitely can't just lump them all together, we were absolutely not in a tailspin for 40 years!! Often far from it, as during that time we had some excellent teams that were very successful and some outstanding players!! We actually played in more NCAA tournaments during the "wilderness years" then before or after... combined!!!

 

 

ORU40, no disrespect to the teams you were on and to the very good players that we had come through the university over the years.  Sorry if it was taken that way. Having been to the Mabee to watch the Titans/Eagles over 45 years, I have seen the highs (although unfortunately not here for the '74 NCAA games) and lows of the program.

As OT points out, the firing of Ken, along with the downturn in the oil & gas industry, created the start of what I had termed "the wilderness".  Especially during the first couple of years when Dick was coaching the team that he (through his sons) and Ken recruited, the teams continued its excellent play that ORU fans had come to expect.  Even the 2006-08 teams that went to the NCAA through the Mid-Con/Summit did so under a low-major automatic qualifier status which were one-and-done.  Nothing like the 1984 team that had you, Mark, Jeff and others played on as a stellar championship team.

Regardless of the output of the teams playing on the court, there have been some high-quality men and women playing basketball on the Mabee Center court.  The intended ministry of the athletic program has never changed and is a high point in reaching a world that needs a Savior.  The value of our basketball program is not the wins-and-losses in the standings, but the lives changed, and the testimonies provided from those that have ministered and been ministered to.  Support of the student-athlete is greater than any wins we can put on the playing field (however, the wins do provide attention from a target audience that may not listen to us otherwise). 

[Cletus]

On 7/25/2022 at 12:48 PM, dave said:

Ah, a Fortress reference. That was my wing for all four years, 1976-1980. I was a music major that much preferred to be on an athletic wing and play intramural sports than hang out at Timko-Barton. Great memories.

After my sophomore year my new roommate (who asked me to be his roommate because we both liked baseball--very spiritual) convinced me to move to Fortress (6 blue) from Renaissance (7 blue) because Fortress had good intramural teams (someone asked about intramurals on this thread). I did enjoy Fortress with all the sports and intramural teams they had. 

I remember many people came back to the EMR Fortress wing shocked by what ORU did to Kansas that night, including my roommate who was from Kansas!