dave Posted March 6, 2023 Share Posted March 6, 2023 It actually sounds like they are trying to drum up the ire against us. Actually, I hope it works. I hope the place is one fire tonight and tomorrow with Dakota fans wanting to see us fail. There is no greater satisfaction for a team than to quiet the angry mob with dominating offense and defense. And I think this team can feed off it. In fact, it is possible Mills' comments may have been said to accomplish that goal. Who knows. I hope the Eagles embrace every boo and insult and questionable call and they allow it to fuel them to be even more determined to march on to victory. Play together and for each other. Dominate the other team defensively. That's what it is going to take to advance out of the frozen wasteland. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nodak651 Posted March 6, 2023 Share Posted March 6, 2023 32 minutes ago, Keenan Henderson said: Coach Mills is just planting a seed to say maybe in the future, the tournament could be somewhere else, besides South Dakota. That seed may take some time but if a few of the other non Dakota schools would back him up then the front office would feel the pressure and start thinking about moving the the tournament to another area. It is worth a shot. There are a majority of non-Dakota schools in the league (6-4). If they come together then maybe something would change, otherwise it will most likely stay in Sioux Falls for a long time. The thing is, though, that some of the non Dakota schools are still pretty close. Omaha is only about 2.5 hrs, St. Thomas is about 4, and Kansas City is about 5. The only other options, IMO, are Minneapolis and Omaha. Sioux Falls has the perfect size venue and the city does a pretty good job of attending games that don't involve the SDSU or USD, and I feel like a new location would have huge downside in that regard. Minneapolis doesn't have a small enough venue, IMO (Target Center would feel like a morgue). UMKC can't even get fans to it's home games - would the city really support and attend a conference tournament? Omaha may be the next best option, as the city does a great job of supporting the college world series, but the Summit League is a lot different and it's not at the level of the Big East (Creighton). If it was in Omaha, would more UMKC fans attend? Probably not. How many more Oral Roberts fans would attend? Would shaving 2.5 hours off the drive time make that much of a difference? It sucks for ORU, but the geography of the league is what it is. UND sends pretty much zero fans to the tournament, so we don't really have much of a benefit, if any, of the tournament being in Sioux Falls, but I'd rather play in a hostile arena than watch the games played in an empty venue like we did while we were in the Big Sky. Was embarrassing and a terrible look for the league, and that's what I worry about if the league were to move. Maybe some would prefer an empty arena if it's more "fair". I wouldn't. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleManiac Posted March 6, 2023 Share Posted March 6, 2023 1 hour ago, Old Titan said: It's not going anywhere; they're probably making as much off the women's side alone as some (most?) low-to-mid-major tournaments make for men's and women's combined. This is true. We were at the girls game today and there were probably more fans there for a semifinal against lowly ORU at 12:30 on a Monday than at most men's championship games. As frustrating as it is, it's very impressive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 I'm from Winnipeg, so I am envious of the balmy weather in Sioux Falls. A little cold doesn't bother me at all, but I am not going to the games either way. There is definitely an argument to be made for a fairer treatment of the regular season champion at the tournament. Others have made the arguments for other formats, so I won't repeat that here. I do feel like the Summit generally benefits from a better attendance at the games than in other venues. The South Dakota schools shouldn't be able to benefit from home cooking though. That should not be an added benefit of this format. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted March 7, 2023 Author Share Posted March 7, 2023 3 minutes ago, ron said: I'm from Winnipeg, so I am envious of the balmy weather in Sioux Falls. A little cold doesn't bother me at all, but I am not going to the games either way. There is definitely an argument to be made for a fairer treatment of the regular season champion at the tournament. Others have made the arguments for other formats, so I won't repeat that here. I do feel like the Summit generally benefits from a better attendance at the games than in other venues. The South Dakota schools shouldn't be able to benefit from home cooking though. That should not be an added benefit of this format. Even more rational thinking!! Blasphemy!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vcboy2000 Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 Being in Sioux Falls and witnessing the commadare the opposing coaches have amongst each other really helps me see how much of the narrative of hate on ORU is really created by the media and spread amongst fans. Go watch the post game presser for SDSU on youtube and hear the second to last question. I love their coaches response. He calls out the reporter for trying to insinuate what he was insinuating. Really cool to see. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmh8286 Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 It's been an interesting debate that coach Mills started. I think I'm in agreement with the majority of ORU fans in feeling frustration that the tournament is played in South Dakota year after year. SDSU and NDSU joined the Summit League in 2007; the played in their first Summit League tournament in 2008 in Tulsa. Every year since then it has been played in Sioux Falls. I think it is defensiveness and dismissiveness that prevents Dakota folk from at least acknowledging our frustration about this - but so be it. By all accounts Sioux Falls does a great job hosting the tournament and making it a great college basketball experience. The raucous fans, even though they aren't necessarily cheering for our team, are a big part of that. The truth is, South Dakotans are wonderful people. Under normal circumstances I think we would find them to be great friends. But, unfortunately, sometimes athletic competition makes adversaries out of people who would otherwise be buddies. I really do believe that is the case here. Dakota folk, you just need to expect ORU fans to complain about traveling to the deep freeze the first week of March. Keep in mind, it's in the 70s here. Flowers are blooming and birds are singing. Coach Mills, I think you better shop the end of season sales for some new winter cold weather gear. You'll be needing it next March . . . 1 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Old Titan Posted March 7, 2023 Author Popular Post Share Posted March 7, 2023 One need look no further than NDSU for tips on surviving Sioux Falls. They have only a few more fans in attendance at these games than anyone else (it's a 4-hour drive from Fargo to Sioux Falls, and the weather is even worse further north). NDSU will be playing in their FIFTH STRAIGHT championship game, and they've made the finals 9 times in the last 11 seasons: 2009 W over Oakland 2013 L to SDSU 2014 W over Ft Wayne 2015 W over SDSU 2016 L to SDSU 2019 W over Omaha 2020 W over UND 2021 L to ORU 2022 L to SDSU 2023 ?? vs. ORU Head Coach Dave Richman, when asked after thumping SDSU why the Bison are so successful in Sioux Falls and why he never complains about the current arrangement (ala Paul Mills), put it simply: "We don't worry about things we have no control over." He also said he would rather play in front of 10,000 opposing fans than in an empty arena somewhere else. He's gotta point: maybe it's time to stop all this whining and just be better than the rest of them... 1 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theeagleman5 Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 Boom!!....That Dave Richman is a genius!!....why do Bison Fans want him gone???.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oruvoice Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 34 minutes ago, theeagleman5 said: Boom!!....That Dave Richman is a genius!!....why do Bison Fans want him gone???.... 16-16 in very down year for the conference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmh8286 Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 Forgive me if someone has already done this analysis previously and I missed it. Looking back at season and tournament results in the years since the tournament has been hosted in Sioux Falls: Year #1 Seed Tournament Winner 2009 NDSU NDSU 2010 Oakland Oakland 2011 Oakland Oakland 2012 ORU (#2)SDSU (beating #4 WIU) (lost to #4 WIU in semi) 2013 SDSU SDSU 2014 NDSU NDSU 2015 SDSU SDSU 2016 IPFW (#2)SDSU (beating #5 NDSU) (lost to #5 NDSU in semi) 2017 SDSU SDSU 2018 SDSU SDSU 2019 SDSU (#4)NDSU (beating #2 Omaha) (lost to #8 WIU in qtr) 2020 NDSU NDSU 2021 SDSU (#4)ORU (beating #3 NDSU) (lost to #4 ORU in semi) 2022 SDSU SDSU 2023 ORU ??? Several things are immediately evident from this: 1) If the tournament were held on the home court of the previous year's conference winner, as we do in baseball, we'd still be playing in the Dakotas nearly every year since they joined the conference. 2) In all but two years the highest seed reaching the final has won the tournament (with ORU being the beneficiary of one of those years). 3) Year in and year out SDSU AND NDSU have put the winningest teams in the conference on the court. 4) Hopefully ORU continues the norm of #1 seed winning the tournament. (I'd condense this if I knew how remove blank lines - can anyone help me?) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted March 7, 2023 Author Share Posted March 7, 2023 36 minutes ago, tmh8286 said: Forgive me if someone has already done this analysis previously and I missed it. Looking back at season and tournament results in the years since the tournament has been hosted in Sioux Falls: Year #1 Seed Tournament Winner 2009 NDSU NDSU 2010 Oakland Oakland 2011 Oakland Oakland 2012 ORU (#2)SDSU (beating #4 WIU) (lost to #4 WIU in semi) 2013 SDSU SDSU 2014 NDSU NDSU 2015 SDSU SDSU 2016 IPFW (#2)SDSU (beating #5 NDSU) (lost to #5 NDSU in semi) 2017 SDSU SDSU 2018 SDSU SDSU 2019 SDSU (#4)NDSU (beating #2 Omaha) (lost to #8 WIU in qtr) 2020 NDSU NDSU 2021 SDSU (#4)ORU (beating #3 NDSU) (lost to #4 ORU in semi) 2022 SDSU SDSU 2023 ORU ??? Several things are immediately evident from this: 1) If the tournament were held on the home court of the previous year's conference winner, as we do in baseball, we'd still be playing in the Dakotas nearly every year since they joined the conference. 2) In all but two years the highest seed reaching the final has won the tournament (with ORU being the beneficiary of one of those years). 3) Year in and year out SDSU AND NDSU have put the winningest teams in the conference on the court. 4) Hopefully ORU continues the norm of #1 seed winning the tournament. (I'd condense this if I knew how remove blank lines - can anyone help me?) Bottom line: it's puzzling that Coach Mills is so hung up about the South Dakota schools when it's NDSU that has given him (and ORU in general) so much trouble in Sioux Falls over the years. Thankful the tournament is not held in Fargo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theeagleman5 Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 Amen to that....could be worse....Could be raining!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
titansforever Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 1 hour ago, tmh8286 said: Forgive me if someone has already done this analysis previously and I missed it. Looking back at season and tournament results in the years since the tournament has been hosted in Sioux Falls: this: 1) If the tournament were held on the home court of the previous year's conference winner, as we do in baseball, we'd still be playing in the Dakotas nearly every year since they joined the conference. 2) In all but two years the highest seed reaching the final has won the tournament (with ORU being the beneficiary of one of those years). 3) Year in and year out SDSU AND NDSU have put the winningest teams in the conference on the court. 4) Hopefully ORU continues the norm of #1 seed winning the tournament. (I'd condense this if I knew how remove blank lines - can anyone help me?) So the winners all went to the NCAA Tournament. How many of them made it past the first game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORUTerry Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 NDSU beat Oklahoma one year in the first round. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
titansforever Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 I went to the record book. From 2009 to 2022, ND State won a game in 2014. Then, of course, ORU's TWO wins in 2021! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManiacAlum Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 2 hours ago, tmh8286 said: Forgive me if someone has already done this analysis previously and I missed it. Looking back at season and tournament results in the years since the tournament has been hosted in Sioux Falls: Year #1 Seed Tournament Winner 2009 NDSU NDSU 2010 Oakland Oakland 2011 Oakland Oakland 2012 ORU (#2)SDSU (beating #4 WIU) (lost to #4 WIU in semi) 2013 SDSU SDSU 2014 NDSU NDSU 2015 SDSU SDSU 2016 IPFW (#2)SDSU (beating #5 NDSU) (lost to #5 NDSU in semi) 2017 SDSU SDSU 2018 SDSU SDSU 2019 SDSU (#4)NDSU (beating #2 Omaha) (lost to #8 WIU in qtr) 2020 NDSU NDSU 2021 SDSU (#4)ORU (beating #3 NDSU) (lost to #4 ORU in semi) 2022 SDSU SDSU 2023 ORU ??? Several things are immediately evident from this: 1) If the tournament were held on the home court of the previous year's conference winner, as we do in baseball, we'd still be playing in the Dakotas nearly every year since they joined the conference. 2) In all but two years the highest seed reaching the final has won the tournament (with ORU being the beneficiary of one of those years). 3) Year in and year out SDSU AND NDSU have put the winningest teams in the conference on the court. 4) Hopefully ORU continues the norm of #1 seed winning the tournament. (I'd condense this if I knew how remove blank lines - can anyone help me?) I don't think Mills is necessarily wrong, the NDSU campus may be 250 miles from Sioux Falls but that's still the equivalent of Dallas or KC from Tulsa. They also may not have 10,000 fans but they have more than anyone else. That along with NDSU's uncanny ability to place themselves on the opposite side of the bracket from SDSU means ORU would have to win 2 road games most years. Last night wasn't a neutral site game, won't be again tonight. NDSU has been really consistent but not letting Richman get by with some "aw shucks we just hustle and grit our way through". They benefit from this little arrangement as well. But the conference holds all the cards. ORU has no leverage until they have options, winning 2 out of 3 would be a good start. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmh8286 Posted March 7, 2023 Share Posted March 7, 2023 6 minutes ago, ManiacAlum said: I don't think Mills is necessarily wrong, the NDSU campus may be 250 miles from Sioux Falls but that's still the equivalent of Dallas or KC from Tulsa. They also may not have 10,000 fans but they have more than anyone else. That along with NDSU's uncanny ability to place themselves on the opposite side of the bracket from SDSU means ORU would have to win 2 road games most years. Last night wasn't a neutral site game, won't be again tonight. NDSU has been really consistent but not letting Richman get by with some "aw shucks we just hustle and grit our way through". They benefit from this little arrangement as well. But the conference holds all the cards. ORU has no leverage until they have options, winning 2 out of 3 would be a good start. Everything you say is good and true, and I agree with all of it. I would add that, in spite of the seeming advantage to the Dakotas and particularly the South Dakotas, the top seed from the regular season has won the tournament in the vast majority of cases. I don't know - maybe the big time environment with a houseful of screaming fans benefits a team whether they're cheering for you or against you. Last night sure didn't seem to hurt NDSU much. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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