titansforever Posted June 12, 2008 Share Posted June 12, 2008 I just came across this on the Tulsa World Web site. Thought you all might enjoy it (if you hadn't seen it already). Scott Cherry, Tulsa World blog About those TU basketball crowds 1/24/2008 3:23:48 PM I have watched with some amusement all of the hubbub about the crowds -- or lack thereof -- at the TU basketball games. There is a magic bring-in-the-crowd formula, and it began in the mid 1960s. That's when TU coach Joe Swank recruited the first black players to wear Hurricane uniforms, and sometimes it seemed as though more people came to the Fairgrounds Pavilion to watch the freshman games (freshmen weren't eligible back then) than they did the varsity. The next few years TU fielded exciting, crowd-pleasing teams and made the NIT when it was an elite postseason tournament. In the early 1970s, Ken Trickey came to town, and the startling success of his ORU teams, coinciding with a slight dip at TU, led to the building of Mabee Center. Everyone who was anyone joined the Titan Club (ORU was the Titans then) and wanted to be seen at the Titan Club dinners before games. Those ORU teams made the NIT and NCAA tournaments when it was WAY more difficult to be invited than it is today. I distinctly remember Trickey saying at the time, "Things are great now, but if we ever slip a notch and TU comes back with a big winner, then we are toast." Which, of course, is what happened. ORU slipped a bit, not much, but enough to pave the way for TU and coach Nolan Richardson to retake the spotlight -- and the crowds -- with some of the most exciting teams in TU history, teams that spawned the most successful era in TU basketball. So here's the formula, which all of those teams shared. At least one superstar player, effective role players with colorful personalities and big-time success on the court. So it went, and so it will go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORUTerry Posted June 12, 2008 Share Posted June 12, 2008 Success breeds success.... Bill Self brought the ORU program back - along with Earl McClellen, Tim Gill, Rocky Walls and Clifford Crenshaw. Scott Sutton has elevated the program with players like Caleb Green, Ken Tutt and Larry Owens. The two local programs appear to be at parity after the ORU domination of the Green/Tutt era. This is an important time period for both programs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmh8286 Posted June 12, 2008 Share Posted June 12, 2008 Success breed success.... Bill Self brought the ORU program back - along with Earl McClellen, Tim Gill, Rocky Walls and Clifford Crenshaw. Scott Sutton has elevated the program with players like Caleb Green, Ken Tutt and Larry Owens. The two local programs appear to be at parity after the ORU domination of the Green/Tutt era. This is an important time period for both programs. Excellent points, Terry! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOLO_Gold Posted June 12, 2008 Share Posted June 12, 2008 I want to stay humble but at the same time I don't know that I would agree that we're equal talent wise. I suppose that remains to be shown but it seems to me that we're still a couple notches up on TU. I guess I could be a little biased Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theeagleman5 Posted June 12, 2008 Share Posted June 12, 2008 Let's face it....TU sucks......always have...always will..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryL Posted June 12, 2008 Share Posted June 12, 2008 I don't know much about TU this year, but ORU has an excellent product. Good players, good coach, winning program, the magnificent Mabee Center, easy access, abundant parking, etc. I know one thing - giving away tickets (except for a few radio promotions), discounting them, etc. greatly cheapens their value in the eyes of the public. I've been to a few Clemson games out here, and tickets are $15-$25-$35 per seat - no questions asked. Giving away stuff (donated by businesses) - GOOD; Giving away tickets - BAD. And another thing - when I watched the Creighton game, and saw those empty seats with white Tee shirts draped over them where there should have been people, it literally almost made me vomit. ORU is better than that. There, I said it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 An empty seat looks better on national TV with a white t-shirt covering it than it looks, well; empty. And we all knew there were going to be some empty seats that day. People seem to forget that on that same BracketBuster Saturday, OSU hosted #1 Kansas in Stillwater, while a fast-finishing TU was playing at home against Presbyterian. Also, the ORU game was nationally televised on the ESPN networks, which meant everyone in town could just sit home and watch on TV if they wanted. And, if I recall, most of the day leading up to the 2:00 p.m. tip was cold and rainy, which always gets any ORU fans over the age of 65 a little nervous about busting a hip in the Mabee Center parking lot. Which all adds up to a lot of no-shows among season ticket holders, and very little "walk-up" crowd - regardless of the ticket price. Explanations, or excuses? Take your pick. P.S. TU fans would likely assert they had better talent last year, but that they just weren't playing well when we faced them. Whatever. To their credit, Uzoh and Jordan are really nice players, and playing at their place early in the season will be a tall order. But it remains to be seen who has the better team this year: both schools lost key components from their respective 20-plus-win squads, and I really like our new players. By the end of the season, we may very well be using their same "lost early, but better later" explanation/excuse... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryL Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 "An empty seat looks better on national TV with a white t-shirt covering it than it looks, well; empty." I'm sorry, but I still think that white Tee shirts over empty seats looks, well; Cheesy. I also realize that all the factors you mentioned were in play. In the 1970's, I remember a Sunday afternoon game against Penn U., that was nationally televised. There was not a very large crowd (I believe most students were away), and OR himself went down on the floor and addressed the crowd before the game. He said he wanted people back east to see a crowd on camera, so he had everyone in Mabee come down and fill in the gold seats, particularly behind the most common camera angles. I don't remember if it it did much good or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORUTerry Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 I agree LarryL.... a full arena would help in a lot of ways - especially the energy it would provide for the team. I think another factor we (and other schools) face is the 'corporate donor' who receives tickets for their donations to the program - and never show up for games. I wonder if have ever considered giving them vouchers instead of tickets? That way if they don't redeem their tickets, they could be filled. With the electronic ticket system in place we could at least monitor their attendance and call them to see if they are going to be used. Just a thought. College basketball programs are also fighting against a myriad of entertainment choices that were not dreamed of 30 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryL Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 This is true. There are a lot of entertainment choices, and a lot of mid-major programs are struggling to get good attendance at games. It seems like ORU is in a unique position to break the mold, because they have most of the attractiveness (facility, coach, demographic with $$) of what larger programs have, but at a smaller school. If ORU will keep on its current trend (winning, recruiting, increasingly higher quality opponents), someday we will have the crowds back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theeagleman5 Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 TU-Presbyterian was a reason for our small crowd against Creighton???...hahahahahahahaahahahaahaha....you gotta be kidding me.....that's about as lame an excuse as i have ever heard....that building should have been full....where the heck are the 5000 students?????....shame on them..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Titan Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 TU-Presbyterian was a reason for our small crowd against Creighton???...hahahahahahahaahahahaahaha....you gotta be kidding me.....that's about as lame an excuse as i have ever heard....that building should have been full....where the heck are the 5000 students?????....shame on them..... It's posts like this that make me wonder again if eagleman5 is actually an opposition troll in Golden Eagle feathers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttowncount Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 ....where the heck are the 5000 students?????....shame on them..... It's long been debated here about the lack of involvement of our current students. It is, indeed, problem and a concern shared by many of us. However, my main point is to address the inflated 5,000 figure. Sometimes our announced "count" has been "students served" rather than full-time equivalent students as other schools report. A more accurate count would be on-campus, residential students. My guess is that number is around 3,000 or so. And, by the way, that is where we would benefit most as a university, IMO ... more students on campus! Perhaps this link to the alumni page of a press release about spring semester enrollment would help: http://www.oru.edu/alumni/online/view_oru_news.php?id=753&type=&month=&year=&offset=70 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttowncount Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 TU-Presbyterian was a reason for our small crowd against Creighton???...hahahahahahahaahahahaahaha....you gotta be kidding me.....that's about as lame an excuse as i have ever heard....that building should have been full....where the heck are the 5000 students?????....shame on them..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryL Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 I agree LarryL.... a full arena would help in a lot of ways - especially the energy it would provide for the team. I think another factor we (and other schools) face is the 'corporate donor' who receives tickets for their donations to the program - and never show up for games. I wonder if have ever considered giving them vouchers instead of tickets? That way if they don't redeem their tickets, they could be filled. With the electronic ticket system in place we could at least monitor their attendance and call them to see if they are going to be used. Just a thought. This opinion and $1.00 can get me of coffee at the QT, but maybe someone in contact with the powers that be will see these comments. Instead of giving corporate donors tickets, maybe offer advertising ? (probably do that anyway). Or, ask if they will comp their clients, employees, family, etc. with their tickets as much as possible just to fill the seats? Or, with their permission, let parents of students visiting from out-of-town be able to use them? I would like to see something given away (corporate sponsors), or some exciting event happen at every game, in order to help bolster the crowds. But all said, nothing breeds success like success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theeagleman5 Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 Sorry...not trying to be a smartA$$ here but if TU-Presbyterian outdraws ORU-Creighton on Saturday afternoon...that's gotta be a concern to us...i understand there may only be about 3000 students and not all may attend....i hate to go back to the old days but in the 70's we had the same number of on campus students and school spirit was high...not everybody went but i will bet 75% attended most of the games and more for the big ones...and on a weekend....the turnouts were big....i guess it just saddens me to hear that school spirit for really good basketball and baseball programs are so low....i would give my right nut to be able to be an ORU basketball and baseball season ticket holder.....theeagleman is not a wolf in sheeps clothing...he bleeds blue and gold.....there is a tear in my eye........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryL Posted June 15, 2008 Share Posted June 15, 2008 No one (sniff) could have said it better. ORU fan in SC. PS. Ixnay on the ightray utnay part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryL Posted June 15, 2008 Share Posted June 15, 2008 OMG!! I just realized the "Presbyterian" you guys are talking about is a tiny college just down the road from Spartanburg, SC, in Clinton. They just went Div I last year, had an RPI of 333, and went 2-23 (only wins were at home). I'm with the Eagleman - Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!! PS - their team name is intimidating - The Presbyterian "Blue Hose". In their defense, though, they play a tough schedule, and are not afraid to take on anybody. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.