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Re: Rotnei Clarke


Gold*

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lol hey I already know we play in the Mid-Con, but Conference USA is the same league that it once was in name only. C-USA has had 1 at-large bid since TU joined the conference, as opposed to 6 teams making the tournament two years prior. Running middle-of-the-pack in a league with one great team (that has no business being there) and a bunch of also-rans doesn't mean anything.

We're just little 'ol Jesus State, you're supposedly a basketball school in a 'basketball conference'. Start acting like it  :lol:

First of all, it is well noted that CUSA is a football conference.  Football is king -- if we didn't have football, we would have never left the Valley (although the Valley was weak in basketball when TU left).  I've never claimed CUSA was anything like the uber-conference that half-merged with the Big East.  That said, it's better than the conference we left, the WAC, both in terms of the quality of the programs and the ease of travel.

We've been in CUSA two years.  This is the only year they've been a one-bid conference.  In '05-'06, UAB (then coached by a TU alum) made a bit of a run in the tournament and Memphis was Memphis.

CUSA does have about half of the old schools, so it's a little more than "name only."

No one wants Memphis.  They are great in hoops only.  Other than that, they are pretty weak in CUSA.

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When was the last time TU played a postseason game?

Thx.

If by postseason, you mean the postseason tournament: last season.

Our last NCAA appearance was in '02-'03, where we lost in the second round of the NCAA.

Still waiting for an answer on that at large bid for the Mid-Con/Summit/Geographic Pouperri League.

While you're at it, when was ORU's last win in the NCAA or NIT???

Thx again.

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I think ORU will actually have a much better chance than TU to make the post-season even though C-USA will probably be a multi-bid league this year. The relative competition level in The Summit is much much lower and than in C-USA where TU has to compete with the likes of Houston (they have Lanny Smith back), UAB (they could challenge Memphis), So. Miss, and now even SMU (Daugherty is recruiting the DFW Metro like mad) and UCF.

I'd much rather be playing in The Summit with a chance to win and advance than in C-USA with little to no chance of winning the league or with TU schedule this year making the tournament otherwise.

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I don't know anyone who has ever made the mistake of "noting" C-USA as a football conference. It was ranked 3rd to last in America at last check. So that doesn't make any sense at all.

Oh Conference USA may have a shot at getting another bid with Houston, but Tulsa won't be getting one anytime soon.

The Summit League may have one at-large bid ever, which is fine with me. I'm not the commissioner.

The fact is, over the last 4 years - ORU has been to 2 straight NCAA's and a NIT, and the closest TU has been was watching it on TV.

That's all I want to say--I know that you will come back with a pointless post regarding old history. So, have at it...if you still feel that you need to prove yourself to some ORU fans  :-D

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I don't know anyone who has ever made the mistake of "noting" C-USA as a football conference. It was ranked 3rd to last in America at last check. So that doesn't make any sense at all.

Oh Conference USA may have a shot at getting another bid with Houston, but Tulsa won't be getting one anytime soon.

The Summit League may have one at-large bid ever, which is fine with me. I'm not the commissioner.

The fact is, over the last 4 years - ORU has been to 2 straight NCAA's and a NIT, and the closest TU has been was watching it on TV.

That's all I want to say--I know that you will come back with a pointless post regarding old history. So, have at it...if you still feel that you need to prove yourself to some ORU fans  :-D

I'm not sure what football rankings you are referring to, but it sure beats the heck out of the league we were in, in everything ranging from bowls, to tv, to recruiting.  It's no accident that TU's football recruiting is much better since we left the WAC.  If you can't concede that point, it's just sour grapes on your part.  Then again, I can't speak first hand how much it would stink to have my team in the Summit, so... I understand the bitterness.  I'll just re-watch my team's win over BYU, a contender in an allegedly better conference, again on CSTV tonight.

I'm still waiting for my answers to two questions: when was the Mid-Con's last at large birth to the NCAA in men's hoops and when was ORU's last NCAA victory?  I honestly don't know.

It's true, you guys have an easier conference tournament to play in, but it's the only chance you have to go.  You'll never get in at large until you get out of this league.  Conference tournaments are tough to win, especially on the road.

Then again, TU has had multiple at large births in the last twenty years.  We have a "history" of getting in the tournament and winning games.  Try to write that off all you want, but it does mean something to everyone from the pundits to the committee.  Fact is, a team in CUSA can get in at large.  Will we do it this year?  I don't know.  But I wouldn't make a statement as bold as your claim that we won't be back anytime soon.

But you'd rather sacrifice any sign of objectivity... at the expense of fact or history.  It's like you're trying to be Stephen Colbert, without the irony -- a troll that isn't funny.

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I think ORU will actually have a much better chance than TU to make the post-season even though C-USA will probably be a multi-bid league this year. The relative competition level in The Summit is much much lower and than in C-USA where TU has to compete with the likes of Houston (they have Lanny Smith back), UAB (they could challenge Memphis), So. Miss, and now even SMU (Daugherty is recruiting the DFW Metro like mad) and UCF.

I'd much rather be playing in The Summit with a chance to win and advance than in C-USA with little to no chance of winning the league or with TU schedule this year making the tournament otherwise.

Silly thing to say, I would love ORU to be in a better league. As it is right now, if you are talking post season, the regular season doesnt matter at all. In a one bid league you have to win the conference tourny, nothing else matters.

Tulsa could make the NIT this year but it is more likely to happen next year. C-USA looks much improved but outside Memphis, the schedules are still poo so more than 2 bids is going to be tough. There will likely be more NIT bids though.

It is funny how each camp takes sides on the history, ORU used to go WAY back to the 70s, then TU touted their recent history, now TU is going back almost a decade and ORU is touting recent history. Bottom line, it is all in the past, even last year.

I personally hope both teams make it and go far.

ash  =o)

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Silly thing to say, I would love ORU to be in a better league. As it is right now, if you are talking post season, the regular season doesnt matter at all. In a one bid league you have to win the conference tourny, nothing else matters.

Ash... I usually like your posts, but I have to disagree with you on this post.  The regular season is very important to ORU.  I was a part of two teams that the regular season played a key role in our final game of the year.  In 2004-05, the team got off to a great start including a double digit win over Georgetown.  ORU probably would have come back to the 48 states with a top 25 ranking had it not been for a half court heave by Hawaii.  Til this day I believe the 04-05 team was Sutton's best.  That great start played a key role in ORU making it to the NIT even though we were in a low major conference without the new regular season champion rule.

In 2005-06, we struggled with our out of conference schedule.  Most of it had to do with injuries and a brutal seven game road swing.  That part of the season is what earned us a 16 seed.  I don't really think we deserved a 16 seed, but we didn't really have any conference tournament upsets to help us out either.

The fact is that every regular season game counts even for ORU.  You have to win the games you're suppose to in the regular season.  Outside of an outstanding season, ORU could earn as good as a 12 or 13 seed while playing in the Mid-Con.  That could put you in a position to steal a first round game, and put you in pretty good shape in the second round.  TU happened to experience this a few times I'm sure.  You have to get a good match-up in the first round, and you usually run into a more balance second round game.

ORU and TU are both fine in their current situations.  Personally, I want to see TU playing at the top of their game.  It would bring a lot of interest to the Mayor's Cup game.  Obviously I'd always like to see ORU on top though.  The game this year will be huge for ORU (IMO).

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Silly thing to say, I would love ORU to be in a better league. As it is right now, if you are talking post season, the regular season doesnt matter at all. In a one bid league you have to win the conference tourny, nothing else matters.

Tulsa could make the NIT this year but it is more likely to happen next year. C-USA looks much improved but outside Memphis, the schedules are still poo so more than 2 bids is going to be tough. There will likely be more NIT bids though...

Ash, I think you misunderstand. Wojcik for whatever reason just isn't willing to play a schedule that will build an at large resume so until he does both ORU and TU are both in the win their league or watch boat.

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Ash, I think you misunderstand. Wojcik for whatever reason just isn't willing to play a schedule that will build an at large resume so until he does both ORU and TU are both in the win their league or watch boat.

What on Earth are you talking about?  Last year's schedule was weak by design, but TU made significant strides on scheduling this year -- we play OU, Maryland (if we beat Hampton in the NABC), at Colorado, and Charlotte at home.  The schedule was supposed to include OSU, but THEY backed out for reasons that are becoming more clear every day.  Supposedly, we also tried to get a game at UNC or Duke, but they wouldn't play us.  If anything,  Wojcik wants a better schedule -- he is more than WILLING.  There has been some disagreement on our board, but many view this schedule as comparable to the one the Elite Eight team played.

TU's problem has always been getting marquee opponents at the Reynolds Center -- this is a problem shared by all but a couple of schools outside the so-called BCS.  Some have questioned the wisdom of leaving downtown, where there was at least the perception of a neutral court that would lure regional state schools like OU, OSU, and Arkansas to town to play in front of their alumni. 

These backhanded comments that aren't based in fact are getting old.  If you want to be a troll, at least base it in fact or say something funny.

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Gold*, I didn't say that Wojcik was afraid of playing a tougher schedule or anything. And I'm not pretending to know his reasoning but 3 times is a trend and this is the third season where Wojcik would rather pay out to teams like Presbyterian for wins (and a probable RPI hit) than go on the road and play a name or schedule a fellow mid-major. Those are facts.

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I think it's pretty clear you don't know the facts on this.  You say he doesn't intend to schedule tough opponents -- yet everything says he's trying to do the opposite.  Just because they aren't progrrams you want us to play doesn't mean that the schedule is the same.  It is improved over the last two years.

PS  TU is a Presbyterian school.  See a connection?

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Mike, I am talking about the regular season and at large bids. I think the regular season is VERY important for ORU in recruiting, etc. but in a one bid league, if all you are talking about is post season chances, the regular season doesnt matter in that regard.

Toby, I agree with you then. I disagree that it is GOOD being in a one bid league.

As far as TU's schedule? Sorry Gold, it is still very poor. I dont buy the "nobody will play us" stuff, I just dont. ORU does not have the budget to play those type of games (please dont start up with me, I know they WANTED to piggy back some of the dogs TU was playing but could not afford to do such) and in general, I think Sutton would rather play some tougher teams.

TU has the weirdest schedule ever. An exhibition game that is AFTER some official games. One home game before December 9th and a random Presbyterian U game a couple days before a huge match up in Memphis. Even the "name" games are against bad teams. Colorado was a DISTANT last in the big 12 last year. Charlotte was under .500.  ORU will likely be TU's best OOC opponent (unless something happens in the early tourny). That is not a schedule constructed to make the post season. As I said on the TU board, it is a schedule that will tell you how bad you ARENT. Also, there is a little known fact that Woj gets a pretty nice bonus if TU wins 20, even if they dont go to the post season. I am not saying that for sure has anything to do with the schedule but... Ark St? Miss Valley St? Presbyterian? UT-PA? UA-LR? SouthEAST Mizzou St? Central Ark?  That looks like 7 booked wins, 6 on TU's dime.

ash  =o)

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The issue was whether Wojcik was interested in upgrading the schedule.  The schedule IS better than the last two years.  There is evidence that Wojcik tried to get other good teams.  Sure, we should be playing more Valley teams and so forth -- would like to hear Woj's response to that.  I never raised the "nobody will play us" card, although you'll have to admit that it's difficult for TU to regularly get the likes of KU to come to campus.

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Sorry Gold, it was Woj who raised that card. There is more to say but best not on a public forum, especially ORU's. Maybe I will run into you on Friday night before we challenge the SOoners.

ash  =o)

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