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Dr. Cornelius

FOX 23: Paul Mills overhauls ORU basketball with eight new players

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#1ORUFAN

Gonna have to call BS on the last post.  Without Javan White we lose that game at FGCU.  The kid had 25 and 11.  Sometimes you gotta leave well enough alone.  Check the stats below and also I have it recorded just in case you didn't see it.  I'm just saying!

 

PLAYER MIN FGM-A 3PM-A FTM-A OREB DREB REB AST STL BLK TO PF PTS
STARTERS  
23 - Emmanuel Nzekwesi - f 39 9-13 0-2 6-6 4 7 11 4 3 0 4 2 24
25 - Javan White - f 38 11-14 0-1 3-5 5 6 11 0 0 0 2 0 25
52 - Chris Miller - f 19 2-5 0-0 0-0 2 3 5 1 3 0 3 4 4
10 - Sam Kearns - g 37 2-8 1-6 2-2 0 1 1 7 0 0 4 1 7
24 - R.J. Fuqua - g 22 4-7 2-3 0-0 0 1 1 4 0 1 0 5 10
RESERVES  
03 - Jontray Harris 22 1-3 0-1 0-0 0 2 2 2 2 0 1 1 2
20 - Spencer Sutton 3 1-1 1-1 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 3
44 - Albert Owens 20 4-12 0-0 0-0 1 2 3 0 2 1 0 0 8
TM - TEAM         5 1 6       0 0  
TOTALS   34-63 4-14 11-13 17 23 40 18 10 2 14 13 83
    54.0% 28.6% 84.6%

ORU Races Past Florida Gulf Coast, 83-64

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ORUParentLurker
On 6/8/2018 at 2:09 PM, ORUFam said:

Above post is correct about skill and basketball IO being important.What I’m saying is this ORU team will have what those teams at the top of Summit league have as far as shooting, passing and B-ball IQ. But with more athleticism. Maybe you don’t give to much to athleticism because it’s been possible to win the Summit without it. Look at the All Summit League selection and show me the athleticism. These guys are not super athletic but can play ball without a doubt. But give me a guy with a first step that is unusually quick who can get in the lane and above the rim and I will take him. Or a guy like Coach Mills said Of one recruit that he could get anywhere he wants on the floor with the ball. It’s easy to find shooters, passers, dribblers. That’s basically everybody who’s been playin competitive  b-ball since childhood. I don’t care if you can shoot if your not athletic enough to create your own shot. Don’t care if you can dribble if your not fast enough to get by anyone. When he said better talent he meant better athletes. He already had dribblers passers and shooters when he arrived.This is D1 college basketball right?  

You need highly skilled guys who are also good athletes.  I'm not disputing that and I think Mills has clearly increased the athletic ability.   However, I like to see kids play first to see if that will translate.  At the end of the day you need it all to some extent.  

Supposedly the euro freshman are both good shooters.  And most of our new guys seem to have the physical tools to play defense.  But shooting under the lights and displaying the mental ability to play college level defense is often a different story.  9 times out of 10 a coach will play the guy who is less likely to make a mistake over the kid who jumps higher.

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#1ORUFAN

The sum of talent remains to be seen.  What you have right now is a lot of unproven talent.  Let's say this team wins a bunch of games playing D2 and NAIA schools does that make them better than last year.  Heck no because the team last year played one of the toughest schedules in the NCAA.

Yes the two euro kids can shoot, but can they defend?  Athleticism doesn't translate to better.  

  

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Fam of ORU

Agree with you guys on all of that. It remains to be seen who can do it under the lights is the real question.  I assume good things will take place  because I am speaking as a fan of Coach Mills and the work he has done over the last decade plus. 

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theeagleman5

TheEagleman will be interested to see our schedule for 2018-19...last seasons' was absurd....too many road games and too many games against teams we had no chance of competing against....I understand that a school like ORU has to play 2 or 3 guarantee games to earn some cash but I am hoping to see mostly games against similar opposition and at least an equal number of home/road games so our boys aren't bouncing from time zone to time zone and pushing the limits of exhaustion during Nov/Dec....I am supportive of Coach Mills and his bringing in a lot of new players but hopefully this season we will be much more competitive especially in the Summit League....this will be a real test of the abilities of Coach Mills' and his staff....:tb-white:

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Fam of ORU

I think playing a tough non league schedule especially before Summitt League games start is essential to being competitive in The Summit.  Record doesn’t matter if your Conference only sends it’s tournament winner. We need to be clicking on all cylinders come  late Feb early March..

Road games in tough environments have to happen if you want to go to the dance. We are not going to dance without winning in a hostile South Dakota environment 7hrs from home with the opponent most likely to be from the Dakotas. Might as well get used to that.. 

Those teams we play that we gave no chance against bring in recruits.. 

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theeagleman5

Sorry Fam but TheEagleman can't agree with that philosophy...OK to play a couple guarantee games but not 12 road games in Nov-Dec in which you are non competitive in the majority...a team learns nothing from getting beat by 25 or more every night....now if they wanna go play some mid majors and mediocre Power 5 teams again...that's fine...but getting hammered every night just beats a team down....I know that they say "losing builds character" but it's good to win a few here and there....last year we were just not competitive in too many of the non league games and the travel schedule was crazy.....more home cookin' please!!!... :!:

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ORUALUMNUS99
12 hours ago, ORUFam said:

I think playing a tough non league schedule especially before Summitt League games start is essential to being competitive in The Summit.  Record doesn’t matter if your Conference only sends it’s tournament winner. We need to be clicking on all cylinders come  late Feb early March..

Road games in tough environments have to happen if you want to go to the dance. We are not going to dance without winning in a hostile South Dakota environment 7hrs from home with the opponent most likely to be from the Dakotas. Might as well get used to that.. 

Those teams we play that we gave no chance against bring in recruits.. 

ORU Men's basketball has tried that for multiple years in a row now with that exact same mindset. In all honesty I partially believe that is why the team Obi Emagano's senior year did not do as well as they should have. Started off the season extremely strong and then played 7 games against spectacular competition including, LSU w/ Ben Simmons, OU Final Four squad, NM State (NCAA tourney), U of New Mexico at the Pit, and then we started conference off against Ft. Wayne, the best team in the conference that year. It did not go well at all. ORU needs to do like the Eagleman has been suggesting for years, play a schedule where we can keep our guys home more, and play more D1 schools like Mo. St. that are willing to do home and homes. 

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Old Titan

All previous points aside, I frankly see nothing new on this roster or staff that will preclude ORU from being picked in or near the basement when the Summit League preseason polls start coming out in a few weeks.

Got a long row to hoe, gentlemen...a long row.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSOQr6g5PUYSjs6CP9VmTU

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#1ORUFAN
1 minute ago, Old Titan said:

All previous points aside, I frankly see nothing new on this roster or staff that will preclude ORU from being picked in or near the basement when the preseason polls start coming out in a few weeks.

Agreed 

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ORUParentLurker

Well two things are certain.  One, this team has undergone a massive overhaul.  Two, preseason polls never predict anything other than a repeat of the previous year.

So if you want to be real smart about it you'd predict a preseason 5th or 6th place.  That's not the basement and yet still massively pessimistic.

Personally I don't see the value in forecasting the predictions.  I see talent there and Mills getting his culture infused.  I see an easier schedule and some veteran leaders.  Top 3 finish should be the goal along with a winning record overall.

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Old Titan
21 minutes ago, ORUParentLurker said:

Preaseason polls never predict anything other than a repeat of the previous year.

You don’t say. 

SDSU will be picked to repeat because they have the POY returning. 

NDSU and USD will be picked up there as well, because they have better players returning than the rest of the bunch. 

ORU will be picked at or near the bottom because they lost most of what little talent and experience they had, the incomers are young and/or unproven, and the coaching staff has been gutted for replacements who haven’t won anything elsewhere.

A recipe for success?  We’ll see...

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Dr. Cornelius
30 minutes ago, Old Titan said:

NDSU and USD will be picked up there as well, because they have better players returning than the rest of the bunch. 

Not sure USD is returning all that much. Plus, they have an entirely new staff and lost every recruit that had committed for the year.

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GoldenEagleFan

My early thoughts on Summit League preseason poll:

1. South Dakota State (Returns almost entire roster, plus Daum)

2. South Dakota (Lost Mooney, Fuller, new coach, returns everyone else)

3. Denver (Lost Amigo, returns Rozga, Krafka, Murkey... adds Townsend)

4. Fort Wayne (Lost Scott, returns Konchar, Harrell)

5. Oral Roberts (Lost Owens, White, Ruder, returns Nzekwesi, Kearns, Fuqua.... adds Weaver, Milton, Smith, Jones)

6. North Dakota State (Lost Miller, Jacobson, Eliason... returns Hunter and Ward)

7. Western Illinois (Lost Ancrum, Duff)

8. Omaha (Lost Wofford, Norl, Meyer... returns Jackson, Hahn, Robinson, Gibson)

9. North Dakota (Lost Crandall, Avants, Seales, Jones)

 

Thoughts?

 

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Dr. Cornelius

I think Denver will finish higher than USD... Mooney did a lot for South Dakota last season and Burch-Manning will have to adjust to being the number one option.

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ORUParentLurker

I'd put SDSU as the clear favorite but I don't see anyone else as a clear leader for 2nd place (not on paper anyway). 

I'm also expecting ORU to play a completely different style.

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Dr. Cornelius
On 6/11/2018 at 1:23 PM, Old Titan said:

All previous points aside, I frankly see nothing new on this roster or staff that will preclude ORU from being picked in or near the basement when the Summit League preseason polls start coming out in a few weeks.

Got a long row to hoe, gentlemen...a long row.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSOQr6g5PUYSjs6CP9VmTU

I think this is probably right. I expect ORU to be picked 6th or 7th in the preseason. ORU lost the most in terms of points and rebounds per game of any team in the Summit. While the incoming freshman and JUCO players may contribute the adjustment to D1 could take some time. I think ORU will finish a little higher than 6-7 but it's reasonable to pick them there.

 

Summit League Losses Summary (League only Stats)
  Denver Ft. Wayne Omaha ORU NDSU USD SDSU WIU
PPG 34% 46% 29% 50% 47% 40% 24% 20%
RPG 26% 48% 24% 55% 32% 36% 31% 19%
AST/G 32% 36% 25% 38% 44% 30% 23% 13%
STL/G 32% 63% 27% 46% 46% 45% 35% 24%

 

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Fam of ORU

E173B721-1AB1-45C0-9589-500C1FCE3D1D.thumb.jpeg.bff2139a50e1dbc013d285a8af88b06d.jpegThis is how I feel about the upcoming season too  SDSU  as the understandably clear favorite with no clear leader for the 2 spot. I too expect and am almost certain ORU will play a completely different  style. I’m very optimistic that the new players and style will give ORU just as good a chance as any other team at the 2 spot. 

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91jack
On June 11, 2018 at 4:55 PM, GoldenEagleFan said:

My early thoughts on Summit League preseason poll:

1. South Dakota State (Returns almost entire roster, plus Daum)

2. South Dakota (Lost Mooney, Fuller, new coach, returns everyone else)

3. Denver (Lost Amigo, returns Rozga, Krafka, Murkey... adds Townsend)

4. Fort Wayne (Lost Scott, returns Konchar, Harrell)

5. Oral Roberts (Lost Owens, White, Ruder, returns Nzekwesi, Kearns, Fuqua.... adds Weaver, Milton, Smith, Jones)

6. North Dakota State (Lost Miller, Jacobson, Eliason... returns Hunter and Ward)

7. Western Illinois (Lost Ancrum, Duff)

8. Omaha (Lost Wofford, Norl, Meyer... returns Jackson, Hahn, Robinson, Gibson)

9. North Dakota (Lost Crandall, Avants, Seales, Jones)

 

Thoughts?

 

1.  I will take SDSU as the clear #1.  They return 4 starters and Key who played a lot in the conference tournament.  After those 5, it's all up in the air.  They have a walk-on junior (local kid), a sophomore transfer from Washington (has to sit out this season) and 7 freshman.  Four freshmen redshirted last year and three are true freshmen.

2.  USD-  I know they lost Mooney but they have about all of their other players back from last year.  Their new coach might struggle early in the season but he should be about to right the ship like TJ did at SDSU two years ago.

3.  UND-  This is a guess.  I don't know a ton about them.  I thought they only lost Jones.  If they lost all 4 players listed about, they drop way down.  Otherwise, they will have have an experienced/athletic team.

4.  Fort Wayne-  Koncher and Harrell are really good.

5. Denver-  The only reason I took them here is because the next two teams have to many unknowns.  Or I might move Denver to #7 and move up #6 and #7.

6. Oral Roberts-  I think I will take Nzekwesi, Kearns and Fuqua with their new cast over NDSU.

7. NDSU-  Ward, Hunter and Geu and their new crew.

8. Omaha-  I almost wanted to take them higher.  They have Jackson, Hahn, Gibson and Robinson that all averaged about 10 ppg or more but they don't really stop anybody.

9.  Western Illinois-  They have Johnson, Webster and Gilbeck but I just couldn't move them up.  

I can see NDSU and Western (if Gilbeck can take over a game) over achieving in the conference tournament.  

NDSU, ORU and SDSU are all really high on their younger players but SDSU has enough upperclassmen for this year and then we will see who's underclassmen are better.

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