Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
mvfcfan

Would you support ORU moving to the MVC?

Would you support Oral Roberts moving to the Missouri Valley Conference?  

18 members have voted

  1. 1. Would you support ORU moving to the MVC?

    • Yes
      16
    • No
      2


Recommended Posts

mvfcfan    1
mvfcfan

There's been talk of the MVC adding Murray State, but the only way it will happen is if a 12th team is added. Missouri State supposedly wants a travel partner and with the public-private split currently being 5-5 Oral Roberts to me seems like the perfect add, especially with ORU only being 3 hours away from Missouri State. ORU has a lot of potential I think to eventually be pretty good in basketball. You guys are in a pretty good market area (Tulsa). Your baseball is also pretty good, which fits right in with our conference (Missouri State and Dallas Baptist are really good). 

Curious as to what your thoughts are. Would you like to see ORU move to the MVC if they had the opportunity to?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dr. Cornelius    175
Dr. Cornelius

I would think that pretty much every ORU fan would be in favor of joining the MVC.

Basketball has been down but our baseball would compete right away.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
theeagleman5    289
theeagleman5

Does ORU have the finances to play in the MVC?...would we have to add a sport or two?...:oru-logo:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WingMaaaan    47
WingMaaaan

Absolutely. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
mvfcfan    1
mvfcfan
56 minutes ago, theeagleman5 said:

Does ORU have the finances to play in the MVC?...would we have to add a sport or two?...:oru-logo:

I would think so. You guys spend more on basketball than Valparaiso, who we just added. I think most schools in the Valley spend around the 2 million dollar range. I looked it up and ORU spends $2.74 million per year on basketball, which I think is pretty solid. You guys also have most of the sports the conference offers. Indiana State (who I'm a fan of) spends a little less than 2 million on basketball I believe.

I'm really excited about your baseball team. 18 tournament appearances since 1998 is pretty impressive. I think you guys have a lot of potential (in both basketball and baseball) and I think you would compete right away in the MVC.

I haven't heard any word on anything, but I'm really hoping that Oral Roberts gets added along with Murray State for the 2018-19 season. Supposedly Murray State already has 1 foot in the door, we just need a 12th team, before we officially invite them. Missouri State and the rest of the conference supposedly wants Mo. State to have a travel partner. I just think Oral Roberts is the perfect fit. 

It also excites me that the poll is 9-0 in favor of joining the MVC. I like the idea of having a fanbase that is / would be happy to be in the MVC. The Wichita State people always putting down the conference the past few years got pretty old.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ORUalum    313
ORUalum

not going to happen.......ORU will never get an invite

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dr. Cornelius    175
Dr. Cornelius
1 hour ago, ORUalum said:

not going to happen.......ORU will never get an invite

 

I agree that it's extremely unlikely. Especially since the MVC added teams like Loyola and Valpo :smiling-face-open-mouth-tight-closed-eyes:. The MVC's priorities don't seem to be athletic potential.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
mvfcfan    1
mvfcfan

Yeah I don't even know what they were thinking when they added Loyola.

Oral Roberts has been pretty good in the past and I think they definitely have the potential to be good again. I saw that in 2011 ORU went 27-7 and back in 2006 they upset #3 Kansas in Lawrence. I think the biggest thing the MVC needs to look at is potential, not recent success. A lot of people on the MVCfans forum like Northern Kentucky, which disturbs me a little bit. They might have potential, but I'm not sure they've been D1 long enough to really determine that. For those who don't know the Valley also made official visits to Neb-Omaha and UW-Milwaukee as possible expansion candidates. You've got to think that ORU is a better candidate than Neb-Omaha. 

The best things that Oral Roberts has going for them (besides great baseball and having the potential to be really good at basketball) is that they are a private school and that Tulsa is a pretty big market. Supposedly the reason the MVC added Loyola was to try to get into the Chicago market. With the potential addition of Murray State I can also guarantee that the current private schools in the conference will want to keep the public private split even at 6-6. Also the fact that getting Missouri State a travel partner is high on the priority list will give ORU some more bonus points.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if you guys get looked at and get the phone call.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ORUTerry    201
ORUTerry

We are not adding women's softball.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
mvfcfan    1
mvfcfan
Just now, ORUTerry said:

We are not adding women's softball.  

There are quite a few sports that the conference has that several teams do not compete in. I know for a fact that Indiana State doesn't have several of the sports that the conference has to offer. The MVC would not keep you out of the conference because of that. Also some of our schools have sports that the MVC does not offer, so they are affiliate members of other conferences such as the OVC, MAAC, Summit, and MAC in those sports.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ManiacAlum    57
ManiacAlum

Would the conditions now be more favorable toward ORU joining the Valley? Because when Loyola was chosen it doesn't seem like we were considered a serious candidate.

Just from a fan perspective it would be nice to have rivals again. It would re-ignite the ORU-Valpo series in basketball and Missouri State and Dallas Baptist would immediately give us rivalries we have never had in baseball.

I would imagine name recognition alone could do wonders for attendance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ORUTerry    201
ORUTerry

As Maniac says, moving to the MVC would create/renew rivalries that would probably enhance attendance. Not sure we would be invited - unless MSU promotes us as their travel partner or the conference wants back in Tulsa. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Old Titan    479
Old Titan

We covered this topic ad nauseum back when ORU was a finalist for the MVC, but Loyola ended up being the choice:  the decision is made by the PRESIDENTS of the conference, not the AD's - and certainly NOT the fans. 

The Valley presidents have their own agenda, and it has little-to-nothing to do with rivalries, travel partners, etc.  Their philosophy is to simply add schools in the largest cities possible, regardless of the quality of their athletic programs.  They feel like the additional exposure in large metropolitan areas will grow their brand and result in increased ENROLLMENT for all member schools.  THAT'S the reason they went with Loyola, and then Valpo:  they are going after the Chicago market, and think those schools will help.  And before anyone asks, it's not about adding TV eyeballs or media coverage - in their mind, it's simply about adding STUDENTS.

In other words, UMKC - or even IUPUI - may stand a better chance of getting in The Valley in the future than do the Murray State's and Northern Kentucky's of the world, at least as long as the presidents in the league maintain this approach (and the power to apply it).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dr. Cornelius    175
Dr. Cornelius
2 hours ago, Old Titan said:

In other words, UMKC - or even IUPUI - may stand a better chance of getting in The Valley in the future than do the Murray State's and Northern Kentucky's of the world, at least as long as the presidents in the league maintain this approach (and the power to apply it).

I actually think Northern Kentucky has a better chance than IUPUI. They are only 10 miles out from Cincinnati (which is larger than Indianapolis).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
mvfcfan    1
mvfcfan

Tulsa's metro area is just under 1 million though, which is a good market. A lot of schools in the Valley are in metro areas that are under 300K. I also think that Valparaiso was added purely on basketball. Their arena sucks and their market value is questionable, but their product has been good. They've had a lot of success recently, and I was in favor of them being added. Loyola on the other hand was definitely based on market. I think with being a private, being located near Missouri State, being in a larger market, and having a pretty good arena you guys have a good chance of being added. For the record Elgin (MVC commissioner) wanted the league to go to 11 and take both Valpo and Murray State. The presidents said no because it would leave Missouri State without a travel partner. The conference announced that they were going to have a search committee that was going to look for 2 more teams to add and that an announcement would be made next Spring on who would be added. It should be noted that Murray State has probably already been promised that will be in the MVC as soon as they find a 12th team. With the public-private split currently being 5-5 it should also be noted that the "12th team" will probably be private. I'm not sure there are any other privates that are better than ORU that also gives Mo. State a travel partner. Most people on the MVCfans forum either want NKU or ORU (honestly most prefer NKU, but they are not private, so I think that is an issue). 

Now some of the people on the MVCfans forum have been saying that ORU has financial issues, which is a big reason that a few of the members on there oppose ORU. I've looked into it and the only thing I can find is the Richard Roberts thing from back in 2007. Some family called the Greens apparently donates a lot of money to the university and from what I've seen it seems like the financial issues are pretty much a thing of the past. Would someone with more knowledge maybe explain the situation?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dr. Cornelius    175
Dr. Cornelius
16 minutes ago, mvfcfan said:

I also think that Valparaiso was added purely on basketball. Their arena sucks and their market value is questionable, but their product has been good. They've had a lot of success recently, and I was in favor of them being added.

Surprising that Valpo wasn't required to build an actual basketball facility in order to join.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
EagleManiac    57
EagleManiac

The Green family bailed us out and we have been debt free since 2009, with a rapidly growing student body.  I don't think we've ever been in better financial shape than we are now. 

Hope the MVC gives us some consideration, but doubt they will.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
mojoliet    5
mojoliet

Redbird/Valley fan here signing up to say the MVC would be absolutely nuts not to invite Oral Roberts alongside Murray State next spring.

ORU had a 3-year stretch in the 2000s where they were one of the top midmajors in the country. Then there was 2012 when ORU was the last at-large team in until an A10 upset bumped them out hours before the selection show. 

ORU has the $ to compete in the Valley. ORU schedules for an at-large so they are ready for years they catch lightning in a bottle. Tulsa is a former successful Valley market. ORU draws 6-9k to big games when they are winning - a feat for any midmajor.

ORU balances the public-private split while bringing a market that would be top 3 (take notes, presidents) in the Valley that's actually closer to every non-Iowa MVC school than Wichita. ORU provides a great 1-2 punch with Dallas Baptist in baseball too.

Finally, the MVC was (BU/UNI/WSU) 3-1 (SIU) vs Kansas over the last 12 years (all Tourney games) until the Shockers' departure. Adding your win over #3 Kansas in their '06 home opener reinstates the record. :)

To me, Murray State and Oral Roberts have always screamed MVC. Their histories, arenas, and fan bases fit like a glove. No one else in the midwest gives me that feeling. 

I hope Missouri Valley presidents share the same foresight. Missouri St President Clif Smart is manning the committee and expansion's most vocal proponent. Hopefully cutting his closest conference mate from 5 hours (SIU) to 3 (ORU) and enrolling students from Tulsa are on his mind. 

  • Upvote 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ORU82    102
ORU82

The Green family is Hobby Lobby and is a huge benefactor for ORU.  In addition thereto membership in the Golden Eagle Club (athletic boosters) has went from around 270 a couple years ago to now over 800+.  Not bad for a private university.  We are completing a $14,000,000 track stadium debt free which will host The Summit Outdoor T/F Championship next May.  In the last several years we have completed a financial campaign that has raised approximately $55,000,000 in private contributions.  And yes, we have been debt free since 2009, and have experienced continual enrollment growth for at least the last five years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Old Titan    479
Old Titan
19 hours ago, ORU82 said:

The Green family is Hobby Lobby and is a huge benefactor for ORU.  In addition thereto membership in the Golden Eagle Club (athletic boosters) has went from around 270 a couple years ago to now over 800+.  Not bad for a private university.  We are completing a $14,000,000 track stadium debt free which will host The Summit Outdoor T/F Championship next May.  In the last several years we have completed a financial campaign that has raised approximately $55,000,000 in private contributions.  And yes, we have been debt free since 2009, and have experienced continual enrollment growth for at least the last five years.

In stark contrast, men's basketball season ticket sales for ORU are at a low-water mark that rivals the depths of the NAIA days of the early '90's.

Plunging attendance for college basketball is a nationwide crisis for most mid-to-low major men's programs.  With ORU coming off so many lackluster seasons, coupled with a controversial and unpopular head coaching change, solving the problem becomes even more daunting.

Can't help but think that a conference home schedule including the likes of Missouri State, Southern Illinois, Bradley, and Northern Iowa would go a long way toward solving that problem with the local ticket-buying public and their fond memories of TU's glory days in The Valley.

But, I'm afraid the solutions to the attendance problems at ORU lie somewhere else, because I see absolutely no evidence that The Valley will be extending any membership invitations to ORU in the foreseable future.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dr. Cornelius    175
Dr. Cornelius
24 minutes ago, Old Titan said:

But, I'm afraid the solutions to the attendance problems at ORU lie somewhere else, because I see absolutely no evidence that The Valley will be extending any membership invitations to ORU in the foreseable future.

Winning solves a lot of problems.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
theeagleman5    289
theeagleman5

Winning does solve a lot of problems....yeah, we may not pack 'em in like in the glory days of ORU basketball but students and the ORU loyalists will come out if the Golden Eagles field a 20 win team with a shot at a conference title and a post season bid.....not sure we would ever draw more than 5,000 or so but it sure would be nice to see the gold seats filled....the MVC would also  be really sweet but it probably is not within reach for ORU.....at least until we can get back to a team like we had in the last decade under Coach Sutton.....27-6.....or something like that....and ORU is a long way from a team that can win 20+ games right now....it also wouldn't hurt to have another Fuqua as a local star on the court....again, probably too much to ask....but OR used to have that saying .....EXPECT A MIRACLE!....and something about expecting no little things to happen.....hey, we have a new coaching staff and some new blood infused here.....it may take a season or two to plant the seeds of victory but it can happen.....TheEagleman is going to remain optimistic for the time being.....maybe we should bring back the FLAME???...GO BLUE!!!...:eagles:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Old Titan    479
Old Titan
1 hour ago, Dr. Cornelius said:

(Sustained) Winning solves a lot of problems.

Fixed ^^^^

One or two 20-win seasons isn't going to do the trick in terms of season ticket sales, especially if success results in Paul Mills leaving for another gig.

"Winning" in the short term may help with walk-up ticket sales, but SEASON ticket sales are the result of people who are committed to the program for the long run, and that's a whole 'nuther kettle of fish.

It's one of the "unintended consequences" of the Scott Sutton firing:  trying to determine if wins alone are enough to bring back fans who have slipped away over the years, or if they have been lost for good due to reasons beyond wins and losses (see "Hayes, Ken circa 1983" for exactly what I'm talking about).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
oruvoice    143
oruvoice

Yep. Word on the street is that at least one prominent member of this message board may not renew his season tickets this year...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dr. Cornelius    175
Dr. Cornelius
41 minutes ago, Old Titan said:

One or two 20-win seasons isn't going to do the trick in terms of season ticket sales, especially if success results in Paul Mills leaving for another gig.

The current situation isn't just due to one or two bad seasons... So I agree that it can't be fixed quickly either.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this  

×