Jump to content

How we compare budget wise.


ORU82

Recommended Posts

A lot is made on this Board about our budget or lack thereof. I did some research and came up with the following for the year 2013 regarding men's basketball only.  As far as the Southland is concerned, our men's basketball budget was tops in the conference.  We ranked 130 out of all the D-I teams and first in the SLC with a men's basketball budget of $2,482,531.  TAMCC was second in the SLC ranking 231 nationally and having a budget of $1,454,693.  Next was Houston Baptist (238) with a budget of $1,422,329, then the following:  Lamar (247 - $1,379,801), SFA (274 - $1,187,191), Northwestern State (308 - $969,105), Southeastern Louisiana (313 - $917,524), SHSU (322 - $866,568), New Orleans (330 - $788,791), UCA (332 - $759,121), McNeese State (336 - $724,498), Abeline Christian (342 - $629,530), Nicholls State (345 - $578,684) and Incarnate Word (347 - $558,372).

 

As far as the Summit is concerned, it goes as follows:  Denver (120 - $2,597,855), ORU (130 - $2,482,531), IUPUI (261 - $1,273,095), NDSU (277 - $1,178,948), WIU (290 - $1,095,048), SDSU (295 - $1,068,188), IPFW (307 - $978,815), USD (310 - $936,975) and UNO (323 - $857,386).  Therefore, in the Summit we will have the second largest men's basketball budget.

 

Finally, if we were in the Mo Valley, it would look like this:  Wichita State (62 - $5,369,577), Bradley (91 - $3,810,668), Drake (122 - $2,555,938), ORU (130 - $2,482,531), Northern Iowa (132 - $2,397,995), Illinois State (133 - $2,388,774), Loyola (138 - $2,364,370), Evansville (141 - $2,254,434), Missouri State (151 - $2,105,340), Indiana State (191 - $1,695,685) and SIU (225 - $1,479,351).  Thus, even in the Mo Valley our men's basketball budget would be one of the top four in the conference.  Not bad!

 

GO GOLDEN EAGLES!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What is your source for those numbers?  And, how are scholarships figured into the equation?

 

My point:  the ORU numbers may be inflated by the higher-dollar valuation of ORU athletic scholarships, in comparison to the other schools. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If these figures do include scholarship's, I can see why it was good to get out of the Southland because if the total amount spent including scholarships at Incarnate Word was $558,372 and at Nichols that figure was $578,684, they basically paid the coaching staff - 0 - and had no travel/recruiting budget whatsoever!  Makes sense to me.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dept of Education 2012 report for ORU athletics...LINK

 

that's the same number (2.482 million) reported to the Dept of Education and does include student financial aid.  i wish you could drill down a bit more on these numbers to see what goes into them.  a lot of it is comparing what a school spends for men's programs versus women's progams.  the total budget for all athletics was reported as 11.3 million for 2012.

 

 

one caveat from a CNN Money article about the Dept of Ed numbers worth noting...the schools have a great deal of play in the numbers and most do not like to show a profit or loss...

 

The comparison between basketball revenues and profits is interesting, but not precise. That's because schools have latitude in their filings with the Department of Education in whether they attribute some expenses and revenues to a specific sport or a more general classification for their entire athletic department.

 

Many schools use that latitude to have revenue and expenses for one sport equal one another rather than show a profit or a loss, a trick of accounting that wouldn't pass muster with the Securities and Exchange Commission.

 

Some schools even make their programs look worse. Duke University, a top seed in this year's NCAA men's basketball tournament, reported the largest loss of any men's basketball program last year after years of annual profits in the $4 million to $5 million range. The school said that was due to a shift in revenue to the non-sport specific classification.

 

Still, it's clear that men's basketball is a major source of funding for many colleges, and that profits are still far more common than losses for the major teams in March Madness. The numbers in the chart below reflect only dollars attributed to men's basketball
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is a great discussion. Two things are constantly pointed at when our university underachieves in basketball: 

 

  1. The difficulty of recruiting to a religious university (which is embarrassing to use as an example when you see like minded schools able to overcome this feat AND not to mention it should be a positive differentiating factor)
  2. Budget 

 

Will be interesting to see if we can drill down more into the numbers. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

TheEagleman doesn't see it as THAT difficult to recruit for a "religious" university.....yeah, if you wanna compete on the SEC on ACC level maybe but not in the Southland or Summit....and there have to be a ton of kids who who play sports well who come from Christian families and go to church....i just don't get it....how many sports stars do we see pointing to the heavens after they score or giving credit to the Lord in a post game interview....it ain't rocket science to get those kind of kids....and in the "bible belt" of Texas, Oklahoma, Arkansas, etc....there have to be a ton of those kind of kids from christian high schools as well as public schools.....I understand that every kid who comes to ORU isn't going to be a saint....but they must know the "score" about the rules before they arrive on campus....taking selfies at strip clubs would be a no-no..... :nerd:

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

What other school similar to ORU are you referring? Liberty might be the closest example and I think they struggle just like ORU in recruiting.  

 

This is a great discussion. Two things are constantly pointed at when our university underachieves in basketball: 

 

  1. The difficulty of recruiting to a religious university (which is embarrassing to use as an example when you see like minded schools able to overcome this feat AND not to mention it should be a positive differentiating factor)
  2. Budget 

 

Will be interesting to see if we can drill down more into the numbers. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I guess maybe the rules on no drinking and sex might be tough for 18-22 year olds to deal with.....maybe TheEagleman is being naive....and it's unlikely that those Honor Code rules will ever be changed at ORU.....so get used to an RPI over 150 from now on.... :sweat:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Strange how you never hear Dave Rice at BYU making these Honor Code excuses.

  • Upvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think BYU and ORU are comparing apples to apples.

 

BYU = 34,000 students

BYU = been around since 1875!

 

Also, BYU gets ALL the Mormons! I have never met a Mormon college graduate that didn't go to BYU.

 

Finally, Mormons are better at sports. I think they have an extra tendon in their leg.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

:rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:  :rofl:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think BYU and ORU are comparing apples to apples.

 

BYU = 34,000 students

BYU = been around since 1875!

 

Also, BYU gets ALL the Mormons! I have never met a Mormon college graduate that didn't go to BYU.

 

Finally, Mormons are better at sports. I think they have an extra tendon in their leg.

 

You're right it's not comparing apples to apples. Mormons have been far more ostracized by the larger evangelical movement than pentecostals –– that's especially true over the last 25 years. 

 

BYU doesn't just recruit mormons and I assume it's intentional hyperbole you're propagating but they don't get all the mormons –– ask them about Jabari Parker. Nevertheless they remain respected and a part of the national collegiate athletics conversation. To be clear, I'm not suggesting we should be BYU –– they are much better funded then we are (not to mention affiliated w/ the LDS, while we don't have formal affiliation w/ a denomination) but we could certainly move a few notches closer than we are. 

 

+ we don't ask kids to stop drinking coffee or coke. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

good point....BYU is highly subsidized by the LDS church.  that is one rich church.  they just spent 5 billion on a new mall in Salt Lake and own 2% of the all the land in the state of Florida.

 

"For the 2013-2014 academic year, BYU's undergraduate tuition for LDS students is $4,850 ($9,700 for non-LDS students)"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

$4850?.....geez....TheEagleman should have converted long ago to get my kids in to BYU.... :razz:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

According to the coaches, one of their biggest hurdles in recruiting at ORU is that scholarship athletes from out-of-town must live in the dorms their entire careers.

 

Back in ORU's heyday, athletes either lived in the Athletic Dorm, with its spacious rooms and reastaurant-quality dining hall, or they lived off-campus in the old "Grad Housing" apartments.

 

It may be no coincidence that, ever since those options were eliminated in the 90's, ORU has had a harder time recruiting top-tier athletes.  Most (all?) other schools allow their athletes who are on aid to live off-campus if they choose.

 

My daughter, who will be a junior next year at a land-grant university, tells me that only freshmen and sophomores live in dorms at her school - by the time they hit junior and senior years, everyone lives off campus.

 

Why are ORU students in general - and ORU athletes in particular - required to live in on-campus housing all four-or-five years?  Is it a make-or-break source of revenue for the school, or is it more about control?

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...